Kansas Wrestling Forums General Discussion High School Official Question

I have a couple of questions on officiating. Since there is not a "Middle School" forum or an "Ask the Official" forum anymore, I thought this would be the most appropriate place to ask the questions.

This Subject is not meant to be an official bashing topic. I truly believe that most officials do a great job and are trying to be fair to both wrestlers. I understand that bad calls are made, even by good officials and that we must deal with calls that don't go our way and more importantly teach our wrestlers to be able to deal with calls that do not go in their favor.

This Thursday at Maize Middle School Jacob was wrestling in a double dual. In his first match Jake went out to wrestle and the official called a Technical Violation on Jake and awarded a point to the opposing wrestler. Jakes violation: His shoe strings were not taped to his shoes. Jakes shoes strings were taped securely with tape around the laces but were not taped to his shoes with tape around the ankle. It was my understanding that the laces just had to be secured, which they were. This one I chalked up to the official just not knowing any better.

Second Match: Jake was wrestling and had been for 30 seconds or better. They went out of bounds and came back to the center of the mat. Jake's singlet and rode up a little and was about mid-thigh. The official asked Jake to pull his singlet down which Jake did. The official then told him if he did not pull it down to his knee it would be a technical violation. Jake complied. Is it just me or is this official a control freak. There is no rule that states how high or low the singlet can be. I would think common sense should come into play at some time. During wrestling matches singlets will come out of place and need to be adjusted, but to threaten a technical violations is a complete abuse of power.

Third problem: This official would make no hand movements at all during near fall criteria. The official would count silently to himself, and then award the points. Both Coaches were asking for back points most of the match. The official told the coaches that he was under no obligation to count out loud or to signal his count with his hand.

This official is not an official I would want to see officiate at any level. If anyone has his name, would you please PM me. I would like to get his name to Keith Ashpole in the kids Division, the Athletic Director at our High School and KSHAA. Official like this make it very difficult for the many good officials that are out there, and even more difficult for the young officials that are trying to make a name for themselves.

I wish they still had the "ask the official" forum. It provided a good opportunity to get questions answered by a couple designated officials and let others chime in.

I am an official and couldn't bash an official if I wanted to, but not all officials are created equal, some probably deserve a little bashing now and then. However, I haven't met one yet that wasn't trying to do a good, fair job. But some don't spend enough time on the rules, or understand that different levels of wrestling require different approaches. Some don't have the physical stamina to handle the task. I started two years ago scaling back on varsity assignments because by the end of a long day I just wasn't mentally or physically sharp as I needed to be to do a fair job. And I've given up post-season for the same reason...some kid shouldn't miss out on a metal because I can't get down quickly enough to catch a quick near-fall or see locked hands. But I know the rules. And I'm now picking up middle school and JV assignments which gives me an opportunity to stay involved until I'm completely put out to pasture. Those matches are slower and more predictable. Coaches are more agreeable, parents aren't involved, and the entire environment is much more positive. It's fun to officiate those kids.

Let's look at those calls. First...the laces. Always start with rule. Rule 4.1.3. requires heel-less wrestling shoes, above the ankle, and if the laces are visible, they shall be secured in an acceptable fashion.

It is a technical violation to report to the table with illegal equipment or not ready to wrestle. So if you report with laces not secured in an acceptable fashion, that is a violation. Rule 7.3.5

However, a referee's timeout is to be called for correcting legal equipment that becomes illegal or inoperative through use.Rule 3.1.5.

The rules require a two part analysis. First, were the shoe laces secured, at the beginning of the match, in an acceptable fashion. Most shoes now have enclosures for the laces which would satisfy the rule. For several years after the lacing rule was adopted (as the result of wrestlers taking a rest break to repeatedly retie them), there was a "taping" requirement (it may have been a NFHS interpretation or bulletin at the time, I don't recall, but taping of the laces was the norm. When the manufacturers started making the enclosures it became less of an issue. Wrestlers still tape their laces, and since the rule says "secured" that would seem to require something more than just tied. However, if the laces are double-knotted and do not come untied, they might be considered secured. That's how I call it. If the laces are not covered, taped, or otherwise secured, however, and they come loose and the wrestler stops the match, that should be a violation. On the other hand, if the laces were secured, and they come loose, that is a violation because they were legal to begin d became illegal during the match.

Now, that's the rule. But do you make that call at the middle school level? You can, of course, but I do not. At middle school, the kids have a short season, the purpose is to introduce students to the sport, and to give them a chance to compete. I have officiated some middle schools, in some leagues, that could not afford, or did not provide, shoes, and I'm sure most of the kid's could not either. Some kids wrestled in tennis shoes. Some wrestled in gym shorts and t-shirts, like they do in gym class. They had headgear. But some had hair that was too long and did not have hairnets. With middle school I "adjust" the technical rules a bit to accommodate the level of the wrestling and the situation. I "coach" the kid into correct starting positions and talk to them about infractions where I would not do so at higher levels. The rules are not meant to be a club, but to ensure a fair, safe, contest. Its wrestling, after all, its a pretty basic sport--physically dominate your opponent for 6 minutes.

The singlet. You said that there is no rule that states how high or low the singlet can be cut. That's incorrect. I have never experienced this being an issue. Rule 1.1 describes a legal uniform. The ref may have been reading the inseam rule requiring an inseam of no less than 4 inches and no longer than the knee. There's a picture in the picture section of the book. It shows the 4 inch inseam and references the knee. So the singlet is either legal or not. But if the singlet is legal, how it rides is not covered by the rule. In any event, if it rode up and became illegal, it would be an officials time out so it could be corrected. Failing to correct equipment, as directed by the official, would be unsportsmanlike conduct. You are correct that threatening a technical violation seems a bit over-the-top, in any event, at a middle school event.

Poor mechanics on near falls. Rule 9.1.5 provides that in a near-fall situation a visual hand count shall be used when feasible. The case book says the same thing. With regard to verbalizing the call, for a fall two count, the count is to be "silent" under Rule 5.11.1. I did not find the verbal count expressly mentioned for non-fall situations, but if the fall count is silent, the implication is the NF count is not, and I've never known anyone who thinks otherwise. For the wrestler who is in jeopardy, it is imperative that he knows when you start counting so that he may, if he is able, get out of criteria before the two count. The hand count is for the fans/coaches, the loud verbal is for the wrestlers. Both are necessary, and required.

Next time you think an official is incompetent, ask for a card. He's supposed to have one and you could, although I'm sure I would, send him a copy of the rules book with the provisions highlighted that he's a bit weak on. The proper approach is to contact school administration or the Area Supervisor for officials. That's part of their job. Be specific. All officials have a bad day, blow a call, or might not know a rule. Also, under the way things work around here, if a home school coach doesn't want an official back that's the end of him at that school.

I do wish we had the "ask the official" forum. Part of the problem is people would get so worked up and spew such vile sentiments that it didn't promote any real discussion, mostly just knashing of teeth. Too many personal attacks that are too easy when you aren't face to face.

Officials often discuss the rules and their application. Its' not uncommon for one ref to ask "how would you call this?" Sometimes the case book gives examples that interpret a rule. Here's a rule application call I've seen many experienced, good, officials miss and most newer officials don't even know it exists: A is pinning B, has earned a 3 pt. NF, B does something illegal (hands in eyes, grabs headgear, etc. from the bottom) and time runs out or the match is stopped. Most officials award 3NF and 1 penalty point. It's actually 4NF and 1 penalty, 5 total. Case Book Examples, pg. 25 in this year's version, I believe.

Chad, get over it, he doesn't like you, you have pissed him off at some point in your sons wrestling career, has nothing to do with Jake. All officials need a number on shoulder, I understand we have low numbers on certified officials, pay more and hold them accountable. If they are a rookie put an R before their number. The numbers are there, require classes on 2 Sundays in Nov. for officials, fund it through KS wrestling, everything is there just needs to be implemented. Kansas has great wrestlers with great officials, we just need to move past the basketball thing!

One other comment. Where was the coach when all this was going on? Coaches have the right to question a call. Officials are allowed to change a call. If a coach really knows the rules book, and can pull it out of his pocket and point to the provision that was not followed, the official is going to be in a world of hurt in a hurry. That's different than asking the official to tell you the rule, or explain it to you to your satisfaction. That will get you nowhere. The errors pointed out here are all in the rule book...they aren't judgment calls. Shoelaces were taped...that's secured, nothing in the book about taping to shoe. Hand count...in the book. Singlet regulation...in the book. Coaches take the rules test, they are supposed to know the rules. Some have even wrestled.

There is probably a need for some mandatory training for officials beyond what is required to stay certified. The state could do a more comprehensive rules meeting. Now its an hour or so every year, or every other year, there's been some changes recently. The two area supervisors' meetings aren't mandatory and you only have to attend if you want to do post-season work. Those that don't have a chance to go don't have much incentive to attend the meetings, which are pretty good in my area. In fact, this year we had two great meetings on the rules and officiating technique. But the officials that need it the most don't show up. For a number of years we had a special rules clinic before the season, but it was not well-attended and many of those there were veterans rather than newer officials.

Officials are actually paid pretty well. Well enough to bone up on the rules and watch some video. You-tube is full of blown calls. If there are problems that need to be fixed, the coaches have all the power and whatever they want done will get done.

Danny, I agree it looks like the official has something against me. Which is fine, but I wasn't even there. Jake told me all of this. Trust me the next time I see this official we will have a calm discussion on what is and isn't in the rule book.

Rford, this is Middle School wrestling. I'm not sure if the coaches need to take the test or not for it. I will say that our coach is a good coach, but may not know some of the minor rules that this official was trying to pass off. I will make sure that is remedied before the next match also.

The official has done some sub-district and district tournaments in the past. If I have anything to do with it he will not be doing them again. He is not a new official but an experienced one that apparently has a control issue.