Kansas Wrestling Forums General Discussion Kids Folkstyle Ted Needs You to Help Him bring college wrestling to WSU, KSU and KU

Hello my name is Vince Nowak. I am the father of a Kansas wrestler who started wrestling nine years ago. He is a 189 pound freshman on the St. Thomas Aquinas high school junior varsity team in Overland Park. Before my son's participation, I had very little knowledge about wrestling. I had heard of Dan Gable and knew about some of his accomplishments but that was about the extent of my exposure to wrestling. In many ways I am still very much a novice to the sport but it has become my favorite sport. I love watching it. This sport is the greatest thing that could have happened for my son and I hope that all of you are having the same experience with it. I cannot imagine another sport that builds character in a young person the way that wrestling does. I believe that every time that a young person steps on that mat something great is happening for them.

It is because of my love for this sport that I am starting this topic on the kids forum to urge all of you to read Mr. Ted Witulski's letter on the home page and respond to his invitation to join his army of foot soldiers to work to bring NCAA Division I wrestling to WSU, KSU and KU. We need to get involved in this now for our children and our future grandchildren. Chances are if your children are falling in love with this sport like my son and I have that this sport is now going to be a big part of your family for generations. We have to reverse this trend in the last several decades of universities dropping their wrestling programs like KU and KSU did back in the sixties and the seventies. Our own children and grandchildren may never develop to become college wrestlers but that does not matter. They still need to have that dream available to them in their home state and we need to give them more opportunities to wrestle in college. NCAA Divison I wrestling at WSU, KSU and KU would inspire our young Kansas wrestlers in the same way that it does for Iowa youth with programs at Iowa State, Northern Iowa and the University of Iowa.

So I implore you to read Ted Witulski's letter on the front page and join the rest of the Kansas wrestling community in Ted's foot soldier army. Let's show Ted that the Kansas community cares and let's give him more than the 500 foot soldier volunteers that he is asking for. You will also be showing WSU, KSU and KU that the Kansas wrestling community cares too. Some of you may be newcomers to the sport but please do not let that stop you from volunteering for Ted's army. If you can tell that there is a good chance that your children are going to continue wrestling take the plunge and get involved in this effort now. The effort needs you and everyone else from our wrestling community that you can recruit for this effort. Thank you for reading this and I look forward to working with you in this effort.

http://www.usawks.com/College/Witulski.htm

If Ted wanted our help then the ONLY place where D-1 wrestling is a possibility (WSU) would be at least mentioned.

Why the negative implication? We all need to get together on this. There should be no controversy to this effort. No one would be against a program starting at WSU. I would love to see it happen. Truthfully though I was told this Summer that the possibility of it happening at WSU was very unlikely. I still hope that it does happen there someday though. sportsfan02, if you don't want to join Ted's army just don't do it but why do you have to throw water on an effort to encourage others to do so???

And were you somehow lead to believe it was a possibility in either Lawrence or Manhattan?

As I recall, the individuals with the dream were politely listened to and no action or commitment given in either Lawrence or Manhattan!

Richard:

It amazes me how often you and sportsfan02 seem to be in agreement on the same subject. Makes me wonder if you two are not the same person as I suggested to you in a private e-mail a couple of years ago.

Basically I will tell you the same thing: I would absolutely love to see it at WSU and if it was the only Kansas college to have NCAA Division I wrestling I would order season tickets to it and I would become a financial benefactor to the program. I will also say to you to just don't volunteer and please do not throw any more water on a small fire that is trying to be started to make it happen.

You two amaze me. This should not be controversial to anyone who loves Kansas wrestling and I know you two do.

Vince:

We are not in disagreement. I did not thow water anywhere.

There is nothing in my statement to indicate I was not in agreement. You made a comment and I replied. End of story!

I have signed my name to every post I have made on this forum, and will continue to do so.

As they say, you can not choose your family however you can choose your friends.

Richard,

It seems that I remember you posting on different topics that if we make critical remarks about something that we will discourage the volunteers and that will make them not want to volunteer.

Tell me then how is that different from suggesting on this topic that no one led me or anyone in our group to believe that there would be a commitment from anyone in either Manhattan or Lawrence. My intent on this topic introduction was to encourage parents of new Kansas USAW kid participants to volunteer for Mr. Witulski's effort. It seems to be if you are giving them the idea that no one from either KU or KSU is even interested that this is somewhat throwing water on the fire to make it happen. It is almost like telling them it is a futile effort.

I personally do not think it is a futile effort. I think if we can get enough dedicated people to devote themselves to a five to ten year effort like Gonz Mendina suggested might be needed at one of the meetings our group had this summer that we can make it happen. I am not naive about this. I know it is not going to be easy. I am hopeful that it can happen sooner. I want it to happen sooner but I am prepared to make that type of long term commitment. I think that is what is needed from all of us. I never expected to get an early indication from either the KU or KSU administrations to our group's early efforts last summer. I don't think anyone else did either.

Maybe I have been overly sensitive to both yours and sportsfan02's post but I just believe it is going to be a hard and most likely very long battle to bring Division I wrestling to WSU, KSU or KU. I think we all need to be positive on it and supportive of honest efforts to make it happen.

Richard,
To be honest over the past couple of years I have noticed any subject Vince addresses, you seem to oppose it. Not that you don't have the right to you opinion, but I just wanted to say that someone beside Vince sees it.

Vince I will admit to being "negative" on this subject if you will admit to being equally stubborn ignoring the fact that WSU is THE most likely place for a program to be developed. I would have no problem with a program at either KU or KSU, BUT I also won't waste my time dreaming about it as long as Title IX is in place. If in fact, a D-1 program anywhere is the goal and not simply one at KU or KSU, please explain to me why you would choose to ignore the most likely option. The answer to me is simple, you and your followers want a program, as long as it's in NE Kansas. Something I've learned about goal setting over the years is that goals should be focused and targeted. This shotgun approach to where the program should be located, simply will not work. Again, I would have less negativity towards you and the plan if you would just come out and admit that having a program at WSU is not an option.

Sportsfan-
It is senseless for you to attempt to categorize the interest as being only in establishing a program in Norteast Kansas. My suggestion to you would be to join in the efforts as whole.

WSU would an awesome place to have a program as well, I know Vince and the people interested in getting the ground work for D-1 Wrestling in Kansas anywhere, lets not feed any bizarre gerrymandering of interest, it is not there at all.

Klint Deere

Klint how else do you explain the omission of WSU from the post starting this thread? Too many D-1 schools in this state to remember all of them? I once thought as you do. But, after constant attempts to either make WSU an after-thought or in this case remove them from consideration all together, I have to believe there are underlying reasons. As I have stated previously, I believe it is VERY possible to have a wrestling program at WSU in the next 5 years. IMO it will take 15-20 years at either KSU or KU under the current socio-economic climate. Regardless, surely I'm not the only one who believes we will need to narrow our goal down to ONE university? When we get into that debate, let me know, and I will get interested again.

sportfan02,

Klint is correct that I and the group that I was involved with are interested in getting NCAA Division I wrestling in Kansas would be very happy for it to start anywhere in Kansas.

This is actually kind of funny to me because I know that several years ago I remember posting on some topic that I thought that WSU would seem to me to be the most logical place for it to happen it Kansas. Unfortunately, I have not been able to locate that post I made a few years ago. I also remember suggesting on another post that I would hope that if WSU would start a team that the Big 12 would allow it to join the conference as a wrestling school. My suggestion for WSU as the most likely place to start a program was due to the great Kids programs that I was seeing in District 2 at that time and the overall enthusiam for wrestling that I was seeing from Wichita which I saw as a major metropolitan city in Kansas that would draw well for wrestling.

When announcements were made that KU would receive all the money over the next few years from the ESPN and adidas contracts last spring, I felt that it could be a good rallying point to get our wrestling community involved in promoting the establishment of a NCAA Division I team in Kansas. I like the Lawrence location also due to its proximity to KC and Topeka. I believe that would help for attendance and media exposure. I am attracted to the possibility of KSU starting a program due to the strong local community support that I can see manifested in the support that is currently being given to the KSU club team. I still think a team could be strongly supported at WSU due to the popularity of wrestling in Wichita and the surrounding area.

I really would like to see NCAA Division I wrestling at all three in the near future (WSU, KU and KSU). I would also like to see another Division II program at Pittsburg and Washburn. I also want to see us support all of them when it happens. I may be an idealist about this but I believe it will happen someday. I may never see it but I really believe it will happen because I believe in this sport and what it does for kids.

sportsfan02, I was not trying to slight WSU and I don't believe Mr. Witulski was trying to do that either. I think you and I both know that he would love to see it at WSU too. Perhaps he should have made his letter to be a double dual with all three there (WSU, KSU and KU). It can happen someday. We need to try to make it happen. We all know it is not going to be easy. Maybe we are going to have to focus on one of them first and maybe that should be WSU. I really don't know but I think we need to give Mr. Witulski a chance and I agree with Klint that we should just all sign up to join his effort now. I am willing to call a truce on this now if you are.

Vince, Don’t worry about the pessimisism, the work and effort you have put into this process should and will be commended someday. It has to start somewhere and you have had the fortitude to stay with this endeavor. WSU, KU or KSU who cares! Without the dream... it will never happen anywhere.

“IF WE ARE TOGETHER NOTHING IS IMPOSSIBLE. IF WE ARE DIVIDED ALL WILL FAIL.”....Winston Churchill


Mark Miller
Manhattan Wrestling

Thanks, Mark. I agree we all do need to work together and it doesn't matter where it happens first. We just need to all work together to make it happen. Everyone keep signing up to join Ted Witulski team and keep doing all the things you do as coaches, refs, administrators, wrestlers, parents, fans, table workers, etc. (I apologize to any group I left out) to make Kansas wrestling work and grow. Together we can and will make it happen. Good things will happen if we all believe it. That was a great quote from Churchill.

Vince,

Anyone that knows you understands that you are all about promoting wrestling. Sportsfan02's suggestion that there is a NE KS bias on this issue is laughable. Nobody takes that seriously.

Keep up the good work,

Eric Johnson

Thanks, Eric. It really doesn't matter if WSU, KU or KSU would get a team first. Kids from all over Kansas would benefit because it would be an in state NCAA Division I opportunity for all the top high school wrestlers in Kansas. So Wichita kids would benefit if KSU had the team and Manhattan kids would benefit if WSU got the team first.

I'm getting ready to watch the Super Bowl now. Jacob and I will probably be seeing you and your son in a couple of weeks at a Kids tournament. I have been seeing that your son has been doing well at tournaments. We saw Josh wrestle at the SM North tournament a couple of weeks ago. Josh looked good and finished second at 171. Hope to see you soon.

I fail to see where it says in any of Vince's posts that we HAVE to have a program in NE Kansas.

Well it is halftime and I am back for another post. Thank you Nigel for your supporting post. I did not include WSU in this topic introduction and Ted Witulski did not include WSU in his petition letter. My ommission of WSU was that I was directly responding to Ted Witulski petition letter to the Kansas wrestling community. I am of the opinion that Mr. Witulski did not intentionally leave WSU off either. I am also of the opinion that Mr. Witulski would be very pleased if we could add a program at WSU.

My hope is that all three WSU, KSU and KU eventually get NCAA Division I programs. I also would like to see additional Division II programs at Pitt State, Emporia State and Washburn. I have a hope to see additional junior college programs at Johnson County Community College, Kansas City Kansas community college and other community junior colleges across Kansas. I want to see our Kansas wrestling grow in participation and fan popularity (which will be fueled by the participation growth) so that the growing interest will become so strong that it will be the fuel that will propel this engine of growth into these college programs.

I know that every person who has participated in this topic so far (sportsfan02, Richard Salyer, wrestlingparents, Klint Deere, Mark Miller, Eric Brown, Nigel Isom and again I apologize if left anyone out) loves wrestling and Kansas wrestling in particular. I also know all of you are very deeply concerned for the Kansas wrestling kids. We just all have to keep sending out our message about what a great character building sport we have for kids and young adults. This sport is for the proud and tough ones both kids and families.

If we keep telling everyone we come into contact with about what this sport has to offer, we will recruit new people into our sport. Each one of us has our own individual story of why we know wrestling to be the best and let's keep telling it and make it happen. Let's inspire each other and others too. I thank each one of you who has posted today for every single thing you do for wrestling. I know that each one of you has put in a lot of time and effort for wrestling in our State. As a parent who child benefits greatly from efforts such as all of yours, I greatly appreciate it. My hope is we will all be able to work together going forward to make more college wrestling programs a reality in Kansas.

Isn't WSU the same school who couldn't fill the stands for football? What is the chance of them doing it for wrestling? KU has tried since the 80's. How hard has Manhattan tried? They seem like the best location to catch the whole state. This is post is by someone who doesn't have a biased feel towards any of the schools. I am anti Big 12, but would travel to see good college wrestling. WSU wouldn't be able to bring in the good B12 teams. KSU and KU could.

I have started a poll on the high school forum to get an idea of how many that use our website are volunteering and how many are recruiting others to volunteer. Please vote on the poll if you are interested. Thank you.