Sweatysocks, I wasn't running my mouth, I was asking a question. Frazier was an athlete plain and simple. He's a prime example of a quick big man can go the distance, just teach him a good outside single, and to get off the bottom. Same thing with Vogeli (by the way do you know what he is planning on doing in college? I'd be very interested to see if he was thinking about wrestling) I'm not taking any credit from any of those kids, they deserve everything that they received. The reason that I asked that question is because the names that stand out from Kapaun and West are names that are VERY familiar to those in the kids programs (Knox, Taylor, Chadwick, Kline, Hoover, Jonas, Cornejo, Deshazer, Tucker, O'Brian, Jiminez). You don't hear of too many kids from those two programs that came in without a clue. I know you have mentioned a few here and I'm sure that there are others that we could go on all day about. No offense meant, like I said, just a question. Most good high school programs come from good feeder programs, most GREAT high school programs take good feeder kids and turn them into even better wrestlers, fine tune, add something here and take something out there.