Kansas Wrestling
Posted By: Jeff Broadbent Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 01/29/09 03:39 AM
All,

As many of you know I am very much against the use of any type of tobacco products at a kids wrestling tournament.

I warn all coaches at our tournament that any use of these products will be cause for ejection.

Despite the warning, I still saw the use of chew at our tournament.

I took him off to the side and made him get rid of it!! Yes, I blew it, it should have been an escort out of the gym. To be honest with everything going on, I dont even know what club he was from.

My question is this...

Do coaches have so little respect for the rules that you still use chew even though you know the punishment for its use is an ejection.

Also, when asked specifically by a tournament director to not use it, you still feel the need to break the rules.

It is my hope that all tournament directors will make it a priority to ban these things from all tournaments.

Thoughts??!!!
Posted By: bigdad79 Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 01/29/09 05:00 AM
is it really that big of a deal, its not like smoking,others cant die from you doing it,IMO you should pick your battles
Posted By: Joanna Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 01/29/09 05:09 AM
i understand the whole "tobacco-free zones" around schools, but personally I think it's a battle you choose to fight. I think it's a disgusting habit, but no one makes me do it or inhale the fumes. My kid's coaches all dip and they are the first ones to say they wish they never started. I can't win that battle; I say choose which ones to fight.
Posted By: bigdad79 Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 01/29/09 05:12 AM
I DONT DO IT BUT REALLY WHAT IS IT HURTING
Posted By: bigdad79 Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 01/29/09 05:14 AM
IF THEY ARE NOT SPITTING ON THE FLOORS OR ON ANYBODY ITS REALLY NOT HURTING ANYONE BUT THEMSELVES
I ALSO WALKED OUT THE DOOR TO SMOKE NOONE WANTS TO COMPLAIN ABOUT THAT
Posted By: RichardDSalyer Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 01/29/09 11:21 AM
KUDOS to Jeff Broadbent for following Kansas Statute.

72-53,107
Chapter 72.--SCHOOLS
Article 53.--MISCELLANEOUS PROVISIONS
72-53,107. Tobacco products, use in school buildings prohibited; school building defined. (a) The use of tobacco products in any school building is hereby prohibited. No board of education of any school district shall allow any person to use tobacco products in any school building.

(b) As used in this section, the term "school building" means any enclosed building used for pupil attendance purposes by the board of education of a unified school district. The term school building does not include a building, or part thereof, used for residential purposes or leased from the school district for nonschool sponsored activities.

History: L. 1988, ch. 229, § 1; July 1.
Posted By: wrestlingmom Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 01/29/09 11:33 AM
No they are not spitting on the floors but have you ever stayed after to clean up? Clean up is nasty enough as people leave banana peels, dirty baby diapers etc...but picking up a spit bottle is the most disgustiing.
Posted By: in it to win it Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 01/29/09 01:41 PM
In the bronze clinic this is certainly discussed.

You are in a public facility setting a role modeling example for smaller children. Just the notion of smoking right outside the doors and the children viewing the cigarette butts when they come to school is much more than they need to deal with since they're tobacco free zones.

The idea is if you have to chew...then swallow. Don't get caught spitting.
Posted By: sportsfan02 Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 01/29/09 02:07 PM
Not all schools are tobacco free zones on the property. Many are of course but many still are not. Of course none allow tobacco use in the building nor have smoking areas like they did when I went to school. Even the students could smoke with written permission from the parents!
Posted By: 24/7 Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 01/29/09 02:13 PM
It's the idea that coaches should be setting the example for the kids. Back in the early 80's I chewed at the tournaments I was wrestling in and all the rest of the time. Alot of kids did, but today with better education about the negative effects we realize it's not appropriate, especially for the coaches. It should not be allowed at any tournament.

BTW-I quit chewing about 13 years ago for health and cost reasons.

24/7
Posted By: my12floz Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 01/29/09 02:44 PM
Kids tourny's are crazy enough as is,and tobacco is a downer, just think how crazy it would be if people didnt chew.
I think if everyone had to put a dip in at the door things would go much smoother.

thats just my 2 cents. I could be wrong.
Posted By: nix Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 01/29/09 03:01 PM
i don't think the question is chewing wrong or right. i believe the question is if the tournament director says no chewing should the chewer be ejected if caught.

my answer to this would be yes for the simple fact if some one heard no chewing and done so anyway, what are they saying forget you your rules don't apply to me.

now this would apply to any rules being broke, say you eject someone for chewing, but you also said no sitting matside and there some one is sitting matside well you would have to eject them as well.
Posted By: Namwen Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 01/29/09 03:54 PM
No Chewing means No chewing. Where i was working there was a strict no tabacco policy. Same as some of the tourneys. I have seen peope let go because of violating that rule. I say suspend the people. I chew so I dont want to get get jumped on by the others that do. If i want to put a dip in a go out to the car. Yes that is still on school property but it is not around the mat or around the kids. I dont even have one in during practices!
Posted By: sportsfan02 Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 01/29/09 03:59 PM
How about we allow chewing just no spit bottles? You have to swallow it! As a former dipper I think that would solve the problem.
Posted By: usawks1 Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 01/29/09 04:14 PM
Yes, we do talk about it at Bronze clinics! Coaches and spectators that choose (in most cases) to violate the law ... are modeling, that the rules don't apply to me!

A few of us "gray-beards" can probably recall when a few Dad's (coaches) use to tailgate with adult beverage, in the parking lots of high schools during kids tourney's. Fortunately, for the most part, that no longer happens.

Both of these, fall into areas that model undesirable (often times, illegal) behavior! I think this should be a battle we should fight!!

Now, if you want to talk about the "no coolers in the gym" violations or the blocking doors and aisles violations or the assorted fire code violations or the 2-coaches per mat side etc.. It seems we model several behaviors that are either illegal or against the rules ... especially, if they inconvenience us!
Posted By: Jeff Broadbent Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 01/29/09 06:22 PM
The point is....


It is specifically in the rulebook that use of tobacco (products) is against the rules.

Richard - Rule please.... and punishment.

Jeff
Posted By: DamonParker Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 01/29/09 06:27 PM
Rule 7, secion 5, Article 5 reads as follows:

"Flagrant misconduct on the part of the coach or any other team personnel is any act which the referee considers serious enough to remove the offender from the premises. These acts can occur prior to, during, or after a match. This includes the use of tobacco products. Flagrant misconduct shall be penalized in accordance with the Penalty Chart."

Chew is gross. Stop it.
Posted By: DamonParker Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 01/29/09 06:29 PM
Oh, and with regards to punishment, the Penalty Chart says,
"First penalty: Remove from premises immediately on first offense and deduct 3 team points. Removal is for the dual meet, remainder of a multiple school event or tournament."
Posted By: Jeff Broadbent Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 01/29/09 06:29 PM
Damon,

I knew I gave the rule book to you for a reason!!!

Jeff
Posted By: DamonParker Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 01/29/09 06:31 PM
Originally Posted By: Jeff Broadbent
Damon,

I knew I gave the rule book to you for a reason!!!

Jeff


Never leave home without it!
Posted By: in it to win it Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 01/29/09 08:44 PM
Wonder how many will swallow rather than be removed from premises--(lol)--is this something that ANYONE is enforcing?

Since everyone that is a coach understands this --- do the coach's need to be educating the parents?

Who will enforce this? As well as in the practice room?
Originally Posted By: in it to win it
Wonder how many will swallow rather than be removed from premises

I find that lot's of water makes gutting it much easier! laugh
Posted By: bigdad79 Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 01/29/09 09:25 PM
what about the rule of no food or drinks in the gym. that would take care of most everything. why not have someone at the doors checking that stuff
Posted By: Jeff Broadbent Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 01/29/09 09:37 PM
No Food and Drinks rule is not in the HS Rulebook, while the tobacco issue is.


That is the point of this thread!



Jeff
Posted By: bigdad79 Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 01/29/09 09:49 PM
does it not say no food or drink in the gym on almost every door entering the gym i think it does so whos rule is it. what im saying is no cups or bottles in the gym no spit cups am i right?
Posted By: bigdad79 Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 01/29/09 09:51 PM
also if no one is policing it people are going to do it right?
Posted By: nix Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 01/29/09 11:43 PM
so if everyone knows up front about the taboco rule and they do so anyway. are they or are they not saying the rules does not apply to me and we can do what we want?
Posted By: bigdad79 Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 01/29/09 11:59 PM
YES THEY ARE. SO WHAT DO YOU DO ABOUT IT?
Posted By: nix Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 01/30/09 12:09 AM
YOU KICK THEM OUT OF EVERY TOURNAMENT, AND AFTER SO MANY EJECTIONS THERE EITHER GOING TO STAY HOME OR DO IT ELSEWHERE WHERE THE DON'T GET CAUGHT. THATS WHAT YOU DO ABOUT THAT...

AFTER EVERY EJECTION THE BANNED FROM THESE EVENTS GET LONGER AND LONGER I THINK.

but on the other hand if you are going to enforce one rule in the book, you need to enforce all the rules.
Posted By: nix Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 01/30/09 12:11 AM
these are kids events where do tobacco products fit in, i am a smoker, and if there is not a place out side for smoking i walk to my truck, just so the kids don't see no bad habits from myself.
Posted By: bigdad79 Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 01/30/09 12:17 AM
I TOTALLY AGREE WITH YOU NIX,I DO NOT CHEW OR SMOKE. I JUST SAYING IF YOU ARE ENFORCING RULES ENFORCE ALL OF THEM NOT THE ONES YOU PICK AND CHOOSE
Posted By: bigdad79 Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 01/30/09 12:18 AM
SORRY FOR THE ALL CAPS, IM WORKING AND THATS THE WAY OUR COMPUTERS ARE SET UP
Posted By: nix Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 01/30/09 12:18 AM
i would aggree if you enforce 1 enforce all.
Posted By: bigdad79 Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 01/30/09 12:24 AM
BUT YOU KNOW AS WELL AS I DO THEY DONT, SO HERE IN LIES THE PROBLEM DO YOU EJECT EVERYONE OR DO YOU PICK YOUR BATTLES?
Posted By: bigdad79 Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 01/30/09 12:30 AM
MY THEORY IS I HOPE I HAVE TAUGHT MY KIDS WELL ENOUGH IN THE DIFFERENCE OF WHAT IS GOOD AND BAD THAT THEY DONT EVEN THINK TWICE IF THEY SEE SOMEONE SMOKING, CHEWING OR EVEN DRINKING AND THEY KNOW ITS NOT A GOOD HABIT TO HAVE. YOU KNOW WHAT I MEAN
Posted By: nix Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 01/30/09 12:31 AM
i would say if it's in the rule book enforce it, if it's a school thing or a rule the tournament direcdtor has set forth let the club hosting the tournament deal with those issues.
Posted By: usawks1 Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 01/30/09 12:40 AM
Tobacco usage is a State law!

No food or drinks in the Gym is a regulation!

Regardless both should be enforced and we should not consider ourselves the exception!
Posted By: bigdad79 Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 01/30/09 12:49 AM
YES I UNDERSTAND THE LAWS AS I AM A POLICE OFFICER. IT SHOULD BE ALL OR NOTHING AND HOW DO YOU GO ABOUT ENFORCING THESE ISSUES
Posted By: Mike Furches Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 01/30/09 01:29 AM
Originally Posted By: Jeff Broadbent
No Food and Drinks rule is not in the HS Rulebook, while the tobacco issue is.


That is the point of this thread!

Jeff


And this is the key, when we allow someone to practice what rules out of the rule book they want, then we no longer have an appropriate sport. To the officials, especially, enforce the rules, including this one. If you don't like the rules, as outlined in the book, and adopted by the HS and Kids Federation, go through appropriate channels to change the rule, otherwise, I don't like the slam rule, I think kids should be allowed to slam another wrestler to the mat. (JK of course but hope it drives the point home.) I would ask a serious question though, why, if this is a rule, which it is, why is it not enforced. If it is not, and it normally is not, then we have gone beyond judgment to a clear violation of rules and are allowing individual tournaments and officials to establish the rules.
Posted By: my12floz Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 01/30/09 01:50 AM
Everyone needs to put a dip in and relax,your all getting worked up over something you cant controll.
This is why they invented tobacco products in the first place.
so people can "chill out"
LOL.
Posted By: John Johnson Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 01/30/09 02:35 AM
I think Jeff dealt with the issue appropriately. When the person (offender) is willing to stop when the rule is pointed out, why would you want to escalate and kick them out. You know where I work we have a policy for everything - but we quickly learn they are only guidelines. Remember most of the people you are talking about KICKING out are the parents, who without them the kids would not be there, and coaches - who are doing this for nothing in most cases. A lot of these coaches do not even have kids there or stay hours after there kid is done to coach someone else's kid. People should just relax, deal with the issues that come up at the lowest level possible. Some sound like the spectators are inmates, well I work with inmates and we are encouraged to handle minor infractions informally if possible, like Jeff did. Or maybe we could just take Nix's approach of kicking people out one step further and just shoot a few offenders. Shoot the first person with a coke in the gym and there would probably not be anymore offenders. And, I cannot believe someone suggested we start 'shaking people down' as they go in the gyms. You are in there all day, and if you leave your seat you lose it. Of course there is going to be food in the gyms. It would be nice if people would clean up there mess. We have enough shaking down at state.

I am just joking on shooting, I just think we should relax on this and let Jeff know he was right in how he handled it.
Posted By: my12floz Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 01/30/09 02:49 AM
use paintball guns, they hurt but without killing anyone and you still get the point across.
Posted By: sportsfan02 Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 01/30/09 02:55 AM
Originally Posted By: John Johnson
And, I cannot believe someone suggested we start 'shaking people down' as they go in the gyms.

Expo Center employee! Old habits are hard to break.
Posted By: bockman Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 01/30/09 03:06 AM
old habits are hard to break is a crock. you chew because you want to. you smoke because you want to. i wanted to so i did it. now i dont want to so i dont. so sick of excuses for this and for that. you dont need to tell someone not to do it. thats the choice they make. now if the rule applies no chewing, smoking, food, drinks in the gym, no standing at matside then the tournament directors need to take care of that with no hassles.
Posted By: Jeff Broadbent Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 01/30/09 03:12 AM
All,

I dont feel that I handled it right.

I had already given a warning, as I do every year in the coaches meeting. And with that, I should have let the coach, ( who walked directly in front of me while spitting into a small water bottle ) know that he was being ejected for a violation of the rules as stated in the rule book. Instead I only made him get rid of it and he was then able to return to coaching.

It is my opinion that many coaches, referees and tournament directors do not even know that there is even a rule to eliminate those who are guilty of this action.

It is my hope that any from here on out will be dealt with as the rule book states!


Jeff
Posted By: WOOD_WON Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 01/30/09 03:24 AM
If the coaches are going to be ejected then so should anyone chewing in the gym. Do you think that the only people chewing are the coaches? Don't forget about the refs, table workers, janitors, security and so on. I HAVE SEEN ALL OF THESE INDIVIDUALS USING AT TOURNAMENTS. I HAVE BUMMED DIPPS AND ALSO LET OTHERS BUMM DIPS. I chew. BUT, everytime before heading to the mat I spit it out. (gets really expensive, but thats my choice) The refs don't, the table workers dont and the security officers don't. With the shortages of refs this year if you enforce this rule with all and by the letter of the law soem tournaments will go on till midnight. So as some have said, CHOOSE your battles wisely. I am NOT condoning it in any way, just saying you may be opening a big can of worms.
Posted By: bigdad79 Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 01/30/09 04:01 AM
WELL SAID WOOD, JOHN I WAS NOT SAYING SHAKE EVERYONE DOWN JUST LOOK IN THEIR HANDS TO SEE IF THEY ARE CARRYING A CUP OR BOTTLE OR WHATEVER YOU DONT HAVE TO PAT THEM DOWN LIKE INMATES, BUT IF ANYONE NEEDS A PERSON TO PAT PEOPLE DOWN I DO IT ON A DAILY BASIS, IM PRETTY GOOD AT IT AND IM FOR HIRE....LOL
Posted By: DamonParker Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 01/30/09 01:58 PM
I think it's really simple. Coaches were warned at the meeting. It's against the rules and sets a poor example for kids. If you're selfish enough to where you don't care about the rule book or the example you're setting for kids, then you should accept the consequences of getting the boot when you intentionally defy the rule book.
Posted By: DamonParker Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 01/30/09 02:02 PM

People against ejections: You would stand a better chance of swaying people's opinions if you gave examples of rules in the rulebook that we regularly choose not to follow rather than just saying "choose your battles because we don't want to be there all day." What other battles are we choosing??
Posted By: Jeff Broadbent Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 01/30/09 02:18 PM
Choosing a battle?.... Thats about the most ridiculous thing I have heard. That has nothing to do with this.

If you are at the Mill Valley Invitational next year I will announce that anyone who is found using any tobacco products will be ejected from the tournament.

I dont care if they are a wrestler, coach, table worker, or a referee. This will also apply to a spectator as well, as I have cleaned up a number of spit messes simply because some were even too lazy to get the uncapped bottle or cup to a nearby trash can. And you guessed it the cup got tipped over at some point during the day...

Jeff
Posted By: nix Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 01/30/09 02:40 PM
no means no in america just ask mike tyson. very simple no tobacco means no tobacco. no matter how you try to bend the rule no means no.
Posted By: sportsfan02 Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 01/30/09 02:53 PM
Yeah but Mike chews ears not tobacco and I'm pretty sure ears aren't habit forming!
Posted By: my12floz Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 01/30/09 03:04 PM
I have been to a tourny where the tourny Direcdtor warned about the use of tobacco while putting a large dip in.
So did that mean no or yes? Or maybe just, ahhhhhh i dont know im confused.
Posted By: nix Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 01/30/09 03:13 PM
i'm confused on that as well, that must mean no in another language.
Posted By: ReDPloyd Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 01/31/09 10:38 AM
Jeff,

I applaud you on a well run tournament. I was in the coaches' meeting when you said that chewing would not be allowed in the gym and that anyone caught would be ejected from the tournament. Although I remember hearing something similar to this at one or two tournaments over the years, this was different. You were very clear about cause and effect (cause: you use chewing tobacco in the building, effect: you get ejected from the tournament).

Coaches, referees, security, fans - think of a tournament like a day at work (often a long day). You deserve to take a couple of breaks throughout the day in addition to a lunch break. If the need arises to take a dip, go to your car/truck, climb inside, turn on a little music, put a pinch in between your cheek and gum, and kick back a relax for a few minutes. Problem solved.
Posted By: bearsdad Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/02/09 12:56 PM
Surprised to see a referee in the coaches meeting at Gardner with a HUGE dip in his mouth I wont name a name even though I would love to
Posted By: Jeff Broadbent Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/02/09 01:47 PM
first initial between h and l

last initial between a and e??

It was good to see one particular coach with a big wad of gum instead!!! :-)

He did seem a little agitated when I walked by him though.


You know who you are.

Posted By: bearsdad Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/02/09 02:53 PM
first initial r
last initial b
Posted By: luellen Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/02/09 05:57 PM
If your going to be a snitch be a good one & say the mans name. I dont chew but you that do can put in a dip in front of me & I wont blow the whistle on ya.
Posted By: Jeff Broadbent Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/02/09 08:03 PM
Will the Full Nelson and Body slams be legal too??

How 'bout we all just buy a cage too.

We dont need no stinkin' rule book!



Jeff
Posted By: in it to win it Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/02/09 08:10 PM
Michael won't get you for "fleeing the mat" either will you now?
Posted By: luellen Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/02/09 08:43 PM
Originally Posted By: Jeff Broadbent
Will the Full Nelson and Body slams be legal too??

If they are not chewing, then yes it will be legal



Jeff
I don't have a rule book in front of me. Is it ok for me to chew when I'm on this talk forum?? I guess not, the tobacco police just crashed my front door. Man you guys are good!!
Posted By: my12floz Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/02/09 08:53 PM
Hey Pat,looks like your little monkey could use a dip, he's gonna break that little gee-tar.
Originally Posted By: my12floz
Hey Pat,looks like your little monkey could use a dip, he's gonna break that little gee-tar.


Yep, that folks is the ugly sight of Copenhagen withdrawl. I move to mandate chewing tobacco at all USAWKS events. Otherwise, mark my words things could get real ugly on Saturdays. We could set up spitoons matside so there will be less spilling of spit cups. Shoot you could even sell it at the concession stands or fund raise selling it in the parking lots.
Posted By: my12floz Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/02/09 09:09 PM
LOL
Posted By: Wag Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/03/09 12:06 AM
I've been dipping longer than I've been officiating, but I can't imagine chewing tobacco and having a whistle in my mouth at the same time. Seems like the shrapnel would clog my whistle up, wouldn't it? I've never seen a ref chew while working a match, but I'm sure it happens. It's not that hard for a coach (or official) to just go outside and take a few minutes for a dip.
Posted By: sportsfan02 Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/03/09 12:49 AM
Originally Posted By: Wag
I've been dipping longer than I've been officiating, but I can't imagine chewing tobacco and having a whistle in my mouth at the same time. Seems like the shrapnel would clog my whistle up, wouldn't it?

As a former dipper and a dog trainer by trade I can vouch that it does indeed cause some problems!
Posted By: John Johnson Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/03/09 02:46 AM
First I do not smoke or chew. Second, body slams and full nelsons are illegal for safety reasons - chewing is against the rules due to setting a good example reason. Big difference.

On the ref who had a chew in, the fact he was chewing is the last thing you should care about. I really want to know - was he a good ref??? If so, be glad we had some poor ones last weekend.

And, on setting a bad example what about overeating and eating the wrong food. Bad examples. Look at the incidence of health issues tied to bad diets - high blood pressure, etc. Most tournaments sell donuts. What a terrible food. I would prefer my son do neither, but if at 21 he gave up sweets and took up chewing - I bet he would live longer. Point is bad examples come in all shapes and types.

And, Jeff - great tournament. You obviously dislike chewing. That is fine. Your tournament - you make the rules and you do not have to justify them to anyone else.
Posted By: DamonParker Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/03/09 03:00 AM
That's the thing...Jeff doesn't make the rules.  The KSHSAA made the rules.  And when the KSHSAA addresses hamburgers and donuts in the rule book, I'm sure they won't be at the MVWC tournament!
Posted By: in it to win it Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/03/09 12:34 PM
No John, it's not a matter of Jeff's tournament and he makes the rules...every Bronze coach knows that it's illegal and unacceptable and the penalty behind the chewing of tobacco products inside the gym -- this is plainly stated in the rule book.

So, the penalty of the chewers should be picking up the spit bottles or cleaning them up after the tournament? haha -- not likely to happen. It's essentially the same as having a lit cigarette inside the gym against the rules. So what's it going to be? Enforcement or Body slamming?
Originally Posted By: John Johnson


On the ref who had a chew in, the fact he was chewing is the last thing you should care about. I really want to know - was he a good ref???


Amen
Posted By: in it to win it Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/03/09 01:26 PM
Now really Patrick that monkey has been drinking way too much RockStar! That poorly little thing has been strummin the same old song since 2007! Time to get him on a drum set!
Originally Posted By: in it to win it
So, the penalty of the chewers should be picking up the spit bottles or cleaning them up after the tournament?


Think about it. How many people that chew tobacco do exactly what is being suggested here, plus a lot more when it comes to helping with kids wrestling, i.e. volunteering there time to help coach kids, work tables, help with concessions, set up mats, roll the mats back up after the tournamet, fund raise, transportation etc. I am guilty of chewing at tournaments, but if you are going to freak out about this rule that is technically being violated, you better take a broader look at what else is going on at tournaments that truly deserve your concern. Kids being verbally & sometimes physically abused by parents & coaches for trying & not suucceeding in a match, profanity being yelled at matside & from stands, coaches sticking there chests out at each other & challenging each other to a fight etc. Anyone that goes to tournaments sees this stuff every Saturday. Instead, chewing tobacco! There is currently 71 repiles to this topic 1843 views & for what? From where I'm standing little more then a personal pet peeve, definately not about a rule. But again, that's just my opinion.
Posted By: luellen Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/03/09 01:36 PM
To the people wanting ejections for chewing. Have you ever--smoked on school grounds---tryed to sneek food or drinks in---cussed---unsportsman like conduct----brutality pinning a wrestler against a wall & telling them how terrible they wrestled. standing in front of mat so no one else but you can see. Left trash in bleachers. If you have done any of these things ever then you cant judge the chewer without being a hypocrite.
Posted By: bearsdad Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/03/09 02:08 PM
I am not in favor of ejections for such a minimal thing. All that I am saying is that maybe this ref should lead by example if that is what the tournament director is requesting. By the way, in my opinion(and severeal others that I have overheard) the referee is not that great. But hey, I'm not out there doing it. So who am I to judge him. Of course that is tell he srew over one of our kids matches. LOL
Posted By: Jeff Broadbent Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/03/09 05:03 PM
Originally Posted By: michael luellen
To the people wanting ejections for chewing. Have you ever--smoked on school grounds---tryed to sneek food or drinks in---cussed---unsportsman like conduct----brutality pinning a wrestler against a wall & telling them how terrible they wrestled. standing in front of mat so no one else but you can see. Left trash in bleachers. If you have done any of these things ever then you cant judge the chewer without being a hypocrite.


You have topped your previous post...


FYI - The rule in the rulebook clearly states that use of tobacco products is "Flagrant Misconduct."
PENALTY IS EJECTION - FIRST OFFENSE!!

We don't, and shouldn't get to pick and choose just what rules we want to abide by. And yes, I would like to see all tournaments remove those who violate this rule.

Enough said.

But to answer your questions. no, no, no, no, no, no, I try to sit on first row when possible, or sit or kneel on edge of mat when a competitor is coming up, and no.

Jeff
Posted By: rassler Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/04/09 01:20 AM
Jeff,
It is apparant that you don't want a big tournament in the future. If you kicked everyone out that was chewing this year you wouldn't have had enough coaches to finish the tournament.I have already decided that our team will go elsewhere next year, You have a good tournament but I think you are being ridiculous. Yes it is a rule but it is one that noone enforces. So go ahead kick everyone out and the following year you can put on a 200 kid tournament. You have such a strong moral fiber I bet you have never broken a rule, Mr Perfect Jeff Broadbent
Posted By: bockman Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/04/09 01:35 AM
What is wrong with following the rules. no wonder kids act out the way they do. if the parents dont know how to follow the rules do you really think the kids will. then you yell at your kids because they dont listen. same parents have to go to school and talk to the principal when the teachers yell at the kids for not following the rules. i used to chew. i have chewed in a gym and i have also went outside to take a chew. i would have no problem doing so if that was the RULE.
Posted By: usawks1 Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/04/09 01:44 AM
Originally Posted By: rassler
Jeff,
It is apparant that you don't want a big tournament in the future. If you kicked everyone out that was chewing this year you wouldn't have had enough coaches to finish the tournament.I have already decided that our team will go elsewhere next year, You have a good tournament but I think you are being ridiculous. Yes it is a rule but it is one that noone enforces. So go ahead kick everyone out and the following year you can put on a 200 kid tournament. You have such a strong moral fiber I bet you have never broken a rule, Mr Perfect Jeff Broadbent


Unbelievable! My prediction is the Mill Valley tournament will have to turn away entrants if they advertised they were absolutely going to enforce all the rules!

Jeff, some of us admire the stance you have taken. The lessons we teach our children are truly part of our legacy!
Posted By: nix Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/04/09 01:53 AM
jeff you keep your rules the same at your tournament, if you have to rely on people who do not respect the rule you have set fourth and thats in the rule book then let them go else where those people do not respect you or the rules.

no less it is against the law to have on school grounds, but on the same hand no smoking on school grounds as well.

oh and this is coming from someone who has broken every rule if's a law or a rule in a rulebook or just what the director of that tournament has asked. you have every right not to attend there tournament.

this will be the test jeff please let us know your numbers next year, i sure would like to know if your numbers drop because of a rule.
Posted By: nix Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/04/09 01:58 AM
dam i was going to the movies tommorrow with my wife, but i just found out they do not allow smoking in the theater, i am told that if you get caught smoking while watching the movie they throw you out.

what nerve do these people have throwing me out for not following there rules. guess i will never see another movie at a theater. lmao

i know smoking and chewing are not the same but a rule is.

my wife is going to be mad.
Posted By: nix Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/04/09 02:11 AM
and by the way i am a smoker, and i do chew somtimes not that often but i am not against either one of those. all i am saying is if they say now chewing or cigs i can go all day with out either and i would be the same.

i sure am not going to boycott a tournament for some chew or cig's. and the post above was a joke i can sit at a theater and watch a movie without a cig. and not be a jerk to my wife because i need the nicotine.
Posted By: usawks1 Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/04/09 02:14 AM
For some reason I just had visions of Nix sitting in a theatre with an unlit cigarette ... ala the WPT!
Posted By: ReDPloyd Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/04/09 02:28 AM
Randy,

I agree with you and Nix 110 percent regarding the previous post. How can you tell your kids that they are not going to a top notch wrestling tournament against top notch wrestlers because they won't let our coaches dip in the gym? That is the goofiest thing that I have heard in a long time (I wanted to say stupidest but I didn't want to offend anyone). The old adage that rules are meant to be broken may apply in certain situations, but not at the expense of young adults who are working their tails off in one of the most difficult sports that they can compete in at their age.

Jeff, I am sure that the club my son wrestles with will be back next year, mainly because of the great competition, hospitality and professionalism that this tournament is known for.
Posted By: Jeff Broadbent Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/04/09 03:20 AM
rassler,

First I want to say that I have never claimed to be perfect, but I do try to set a good example in front of the kids I coach not only on the mat, but also on the football field and on the baseball diamond.

With that said, I would like to know who you are because I can see to it that your team will not be allowed at the Mill Valley Invitational next year or any year there after as long as I am the Tourney Director, if that is your wish.

People, dont take this personally, but I will abide by the rule book as best I know how.

My whole point of this thread was to bring to the forefront the use of tobacco products is a violation of our rules. It is also bad for you, and sets a bad example for those small impressionable kids that you work with each and every day.

rassler - please PM me. Your identity will not be disclosed.
Posted By: bigdad79 Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/04/09 03:24 AM
where do you coach football Jeff?
Posted By: Jeff Broadbent Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/04/09 03:30 AM
In the Blue Valley Football League.

Great organization.

And no I will not have chew on the sidelines. :-)
Posted By: bigdad79 Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/04/09 03:32 AM
how does it compare to the heritage league?
Posted By: bigdad79 Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/04/09 03:34 AM
im looking for a change our coach is a whackadoodle!!!!!!!!!!!LOL
Posted By: Jeff Broadbent Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/04/09 03:42 AM
bigdad79 clear your pm. trying to send info to you.
Posted By: Jeff Broadbent Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/04/09 03:43 AM
Originally Posted By: rassler
Follow the rules. Either shave or sit its that simple.


Managed to pull up an old quote from rassler....

Quite an amazing concept isnt it rassler...

Read it carefully.
Posted By: bigdad79 Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/04/09 03:58 AM
should be clear jeff
Posted By: sportsfan02 Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/04/09 09:13 AM
Originally Posted By: nix

no less it is against the law to have on school grounds, but on the same hand no smoking on school grounds as well.

I do not believe that is true. I think it is illegal to smoke IN school buildings in this state. Not sure about smokeless tobacco but if a school district does not want to allow smoking anywhere on their properties they have to pass their own rules regarding such.
Posted By: RichardDSalyer Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/04/09 10:55 AM
Originally Posted By: sportsfan02
Not sure about smokeless tobacco
Smokeless tobacco is a tobacco product and is banned in school BUILDINGS by Kansas Statute.

72-53,107
Chapter 72.--SCHOOLS
Article 53.--MISCELLANEOUS PROVISIONS
72-53,107. Tobacco products, use in school buildings prohibited; school building defined. (a) The use of tobacco products in any school building is hereby prohibited. No board of education of any school district shall allow any person to use tobacco products in any school building.

(b) As used in this section, the term "school building" means any enclosed building used for pupil attendance purposes by the board of education of a unified school district. The term school building does not include a building, or part thereof, used for residential purposes or leased from the school district for nonschool sponsored activities.

History: L. 1988, ch. 229, § 1; July 1.
Posted By: Mike Furches Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/04/09 11:30 AM
Tell you what Jeff, regarding coaches and teams not showing up. I will be officiating again come spring. I will also be back on the mat next year as I am taking this year off to enjoy my son. That said, you want the rules enforced, I will gladly do my best to enforce all the rules next year if you need an official. I may not agree with the rules, i.e. I don't agree with the ejection of a coach, parent or fan for this particular rule, however, as an official, there is a commitment and responsibility to enforce the rules, including this one. If people don't like the rule, get it modified as USAWKS modifies rules for kids’ events, otherwise, any official who picks and chooses which rules to enforce or not, runs the risk of ruining the sport. I for one admire a coach and club that want all of the rules enforced. If your attendance is down because you as a tournament decide to enforce all rules, then I will gladly donate a large portion of my services to help out with the overall costs and loss. For some reason though, I don’t think this will be an issue. I have been hearing about some people not going to certain tournaments from year to year, and the bottom line, there are always others to replace those few.
Posted By: RichardDSalyer Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/04/09 12:12 PM
USAW Kansas does not attempt to regulate adult decisions regarding adult health issues.

USAW Kansas does follow the rules as set forth by the National Federation of State High School Associations (NFHS) unless modified by our State Association.

The NFHS Coaches Code of of Ethics is primarily directed toward High School coaches and personnel, however the Code of Ethics is in the NFHS Wrestling Rules Book which USAW Kansas does follow

BY-LAWS
SECTION III: TOURNAMENT OPERATIONS
PART A – SANCTIONED FOLKSTYLE TOURNAMENTS

3. All sanctioned tournaments must comply with the rules in the annual publication by the National Federation of State High School Associations (NFSHSA), unless otherwise specified in this document.

NFSHSA - Coaches Code of Ethics

The Coaches Code of Ethics

The function of a coach is to educate students through participation in interscholastic competition. An interscholastic program should be designed to enhance academic achievement and should never interfere with opportunities for academic success. Each student-athlete should be treated as though he or she were the coaches' own, and his or her welfare should be uppermost at all times. Accordingly, the following guidelines for coaches have been adopted by the NFCA Board of Directors.

The coach shall be aware that he or she has a tremendous influence, for either good or ill, on the education of the student-athlete and, thus, shall never place the value of winning above the value of instilling the highest ideals of character.

The coach shall uphold the honor and dignity of the profession. In all personal contact with student-athletes, officials, athletic directors, school administrators, the state high school athletic association, the media, and the public, the coach shall strive to set an example of the highest ethical and moral conduct.

The coach shall take an active role in the prevention of drug, alcohol and tobacco abuse.

The coach shall avoid the use of alcohol and tobacco products when in contact with players.
Posted By: Jeff Broadbent Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/04/09 12:23 PM
Better yet:

Check out #4!




USA WRESTLING - KANSAS, INC.
COACH'S/TEAM LEADER'S CODE OF CONDUCT


1. Coaches and Team Leaders representing USA Wrestling – Kansas, Inc. (USAWKS) in state, regional, national, and international events (including but not limited to training camps and other team or meet functions) will conduct themselves in a way that will bring honor to their team, state, and country.

2. Coaches and Team Leaders must be considerate of other communities’, states’ and countries' laws, customs, and morals.

3. Coaches and Team Leaders, by agreeing to participate in an event, assume responsibility for the well being of the athletes participating in the event. This is a great responsibility! It is the Coaches' and Team Leaders' responsibility to supervise the athletes, to encourage proper behavior by the athletes, and to ensure the athletes' well being and safety. Each Coach and Team Leader is expected to display appropriate behavior and language while performing their assigned responsibilities.

4. Coaches and Team Leaders shall not consume alcoholic beverages or use tobacco products during such times that they are assigned duties with regard to the athletes. In no instance shall alcohol be consumed or tobacco products be used in the presence of an athlete. Coaches or Team Leaders that elect to partake of alcoholic beverages or use tobacco products outside the presence of the athletes, during unassigned time, are expected to do so responsibly. Coaches who partake of alcoholic beverages are expected to report for their assigned duties in an unimpaired condition.

5. Coaches and Team Leaders shall not participate in any illegal activity or encourage athletes to participate in any illegal activity.


I _______________________________, have read and understand the Coach's/Team Leader's Code of Conduct and agree to abide by the terms and conditions in this agreement. I also realize that failure to execute the terms and conditions of this Coach's/Team Leader's Code of Conduct shall subject me to possible disciplinary actions, including but not limited to suspension or termination of privileges and rights associated with any and all USAWKS activities. Disciplinary problems will be investigated by the Team Leader, Assistant Team Leader and/or Head Coach and subsequently by the USAWKS Board of Directors. After investigation, if immediate disciplinary action is deemed necessary, the Team Leader, Assistant Team Leader, and/or Head Coach shall take appropriate action and shall promptly report the action to the USAWKS Board of Directors. The USAWKS Board of Directors shall have right to fully investigate all failures in executing the terms and conditions of the Coach's/Team Leader's Code of Conduct and to impose additional disciplinary action if deemed appropriate.


Coach/Team Leader Signature:________________________________ Date: _____________
Posted By: sportsfan02 Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/04/09 01:07 PM
When you have parents that happen to be coaches and also happen to use tobacco products, at what point do they cease being a coach and become a parent again and can use tobacco products or alcohol in the presence of their child?
Posted By: in it to win it Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/04/09 01:30 PM
Really doesn't matter sportsfan -- tobacco products are prohibited within the gymnasium, this is a rule far and beyond USAW-KS.
Posted By: sportsfan02 Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/04/09 01:34 PM
I'm not talking about the gym. We seem to be getting into other areas altogether. I see motels mentioned etc.
Posted By: smokeycabin Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/04/09 08:23 PM
Please everyone answer the statement below yes or no. Let’s be honest. We are trying to set a good example.


In no instance shall alcohol be consumed or tobacco products be used in the presence of an athlete.

Answer YES if you had alcohol or tobacco in the presence of an athlete.
Answer NO if you never had alcohol or tobacco in the presence of an athlete.

If you answered YES to this statement was it more than 2 times?
If you answered YES to this statement was it more than 3 times?

It does not state whether or not the athlete is your own child. It doesn’t even say how old the athlete is – it could have been in college.


Enough said.

But to answer your questions. no, no, no, no, no, no, I try to sit on first row when possible, or sit or kneel on edge of mat when a competitor is coming up, and no.

Jeff


This is in the rules:

In no instance shall alcohol be consumed or tobacco products be used in the presence of an athlete.


What happens when a coach, club director, teacher, anyone affiliated with the club has a beer or a cigar - at a wedding reception at a city civic center and or public school, funeral, church picnic, old shawnee days, Lenexa BBQ, State Fair, and they are in the presence of one of their athletes and/or children - is that in violation of the rules. It would be IMO. Have you and/or anyone affiliated with your club ever done any of these?

I am smelling a double standard on the rules.
Posted By: Jeff Broadbent Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/04/09 08:29 PM
C'mon Sean,

I think you, and many others out there know the intent of the rule... Don't you?


Jeff
Posted By: smokeycabin Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/04/09 08:38 PM
C'mom Jeff

I think now a Rule is a Rule! Not just its intent... Don't you?

Sean
Posted By: Jeff Broadbent Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/04/09 08:50 PM
When I walk into the practice room, I am their coach. They are my athletes. When I walk out of the room, I am an ordinary person. They are ordinary kids.

When I walk into the gymnasium for a tournament, I am their coach. They are my athletes. When I walk out of the gymnasium, I am an ordinary person. They are ordinary kids.

I do, however, try to be a positive influence on all of the kids who I come to know from wrestling and other sports.
Posted By: shawnbudke Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/04/09 08:58 PM
Where's that rule? So now we can choose when we are coaches and when we aren't? What if you see them in the hallway during practice...coach or not? How about the parking lot....coach or not? What about at weigh ins that aren't in the practice room or gymnasium?

Splitting hairs...yes. A little over the top...absolutely. But there have been comments on here about people breaking rules and that we should obey all of them, etc. The point is that if you are going to go down that road then make sure you clearly define the rule or live by the vague guidelines. This is what makes it so challenging.

Shawn Budke
Posted By: nix Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/04/09 09:01 PM
your not always the coach and the athlete, when i am coaching my boy at home i am his coach, when he is at practice his coaches are his coaches, when we are at a tournament we are his coaches. but when were not he's my son, if he's at the coaches house there not his coach at that time, they are simply the father of my boy's friend.

this turned into no chew in the gym at a kids wrestling tournament. to oh you breaking the rules, if you have a chew at a fair with you son.

jeff i don't believe you need to explain no more, you said no chew the rule book says no tobacco , there will always be people trying to spin the web in there direction.
Posted By: Jeff Broadbent Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/04/09 09:19 PM
I was just explaining when I felt I was their coach Shawn, ( not to be confused with Sean).

I still do not chew in front of them, or anyone else for that matter.



Jeff
Posted By: smokeycabin Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/04/09 09:21 PM
So walking around smoking a cig or having a beer is OK in front of young athletes. Out in the parking lot, in the house (second hand smoke), where ever kids are watching.

This is pretty definte: I did not make this rule. Read it carefully.

IN NO INSTANCE

"In no instance shall alcohol be consumed or tobacco products be used in the presence of an athlete."

I am justing using information provided by Mr. Broadbent (happier) and Mr. Salyer - I do not have the sited source where the data came from on this one.

Sean McCarthy


Posted By: Jeff Broadbent Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/04/09 09:24 PM
Shaun MuKarthee,

I like the way it reads, lets not change a thing!!! :-)

Jeff Broadbent
Posted By: usawks1 Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/04/09 09:29 PM
Is it acceptable to have a dip in your lip or beer on your breathe at practice? I don't think so!

We (coaches) are not always wearing our coaching hat! Our athletes need to understand that there is adult behavior that can be handled in an adult manner!

My rule (for me and what I express to my bronze attendees) is I will consume no alcohol within 8 hours of having "coaching" contact with your kids. Further, I will consume no tobacco while I am coaching!

If my athletes contact me outside the wrestling venues ... and I am participating in adult behavior (having an adult beverage or tobacco) ... I hope I am demonstrating that there is an acceptable way to participate in such behavior!! I feel that this is a lesson we can impart to our athletes!!
Posted By: Jeff Broadbent Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/04/09 09:53 PM
4. Coaches and Team Leaders shall not consume alcoholic beverages or use tobacco products during such times that they are assigned duties with regard to the athletes. In no instance shall alcohol be consumed or tobacco products be used in the presence of an athlete. Coaches or Team Leaders that elect to partake of alcoholic beverages or use tobacco products outside the presence of the athletes, during unassigned time, are expected to do so responsibly. Coaches who partake of alcoholic beverages are expected to report for their assigned duties in an unimpaired condition.
Posted By: John Johnson Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/04/09 10:30 PM
Patrick kind of implied that this thread is getting more attention then it is worth. In a way I agree and in a way I do not. I believe this thread hits something bigger then chewing. Its the difference between those who believe a rule must be followed - and to the tee - regardless!!! And, those who have a little more flexibility. I would bet if you ask a traffic cop, they don't write a ticket for every offense. They sometimes give warnings. I think about the Football Coach in Hutchinson who was in trouble for cussing in front of his players at a camp - some people wanted his head. I look at it different - I want to know if he is a good coach. And, I recognize he can set a good example for my son even if he has faults. I WILL EXPLAIN that myself to my son at home. And, at least one of my son's current coachs chews and he also has ear rings. My son thinks the world of him, but he still has not asked me to get ear rings. Smoky hit it real well, these rules have no limits or boundaries - they appear to have applied to the hotel bars and pool areas in Salina last weekend - where I will know these rules were broken many times.

On to picking which rules to follow - someone said the rules were set by KSHSAA - well, tell me if I am wrong - but they do not allow Jr High and High School kids to practice together and wrestle against each other, right, but we do. Also, I understand from another post on another topic, Kansas does not follow the national rule on weigh-ins. So, where does the picking and choosing stop - why can't a tournament director do the same.
Posted By: bockman Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/05/09 12:42 AM
your always going to have people like smokeycabin that just want to stir up the crowd. he has done a good job with that. guess if chewing is more important than being a coach at a tournament then i say let those kind of people go elsewhere and wrestle. he chose what was important to him the rest of us will try to do what we think is best for the kids and not just our own.
Posted By: mmeditz Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/05/09 01:46 AM
I am not speaking for or against smokeless tobacco. I do not use any tobacco products. I have heard that refraining from using chew is exponentially harder then it is to stop smoking. As I said, I don't use either so I can't say for sure. I just know that I get very stressed at points during the long wrestling tournys and can only imagine if I was a skoal bandit(lol) I would probably be fighting a terrible craving all day. As I see smokers get to exit the building and light up and return, I dont see it being as easy for someone to go out and dip, spit and return.

I do believe that rules should be followed, just ask my kids, but as my wife is constantly telling me,"you have to pick your battles." I think that the rule is there and people should try and follow it. If they have weak moments or are capable of concealing the by-product(spit)try and be understanding. Smoking poses health risks to innocent bystanders and makes it uncomfortable for us non smokers to even breathe. If I can't see it, I'm not looking for it.

Lets give it a rest. 6 pages on this topic, seriously!
Posted By: wrestlingmom Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/05/09 03:14 AM
Scott,

You obviously have no idea who "smokeycabin" is...Sean is one of those in the state that has given countless hours to this sport and has asked for nothing in return. He coached kids wrestling before his own son was old enough and has continued to be the head coach for our club (STA) even though his son is now in college (check out West Point wrestling).

He could easily walk away from it all but he is one of those rare people who is in it not just for his own kid but for every kid who walks thru the doors at STA Wrestling. You usually also catch him helping out at other tournaments (after he is done in hospitality room) helping hang brackets, even handing out medals.

Sean has been nothing but a positive influence on my two kids who wrestle. I imagine a lot of others in the community would say the same thing. Ask his former wrestlers who are now coaching in high school or wrestling in college, ask many of the current wrestlers at St. Thomas Aquinas or at other Jo Co high schools, ask current members of STA Wrestling...we would not have STA Wrestling without Sean and the wrestling community as a whole would lose somebody who is dedicated to this sport.

Oh...and I have been guilty of sneaking coolers into gyms (against the rules) almost every weekend I can get away with it.
Posted By: Jeff Broadbent Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/05/09 12:28 PM
People,

Plain and simple...

This thread isn't about Sean, or any other Tom, Richard, or Harry.

This thread is about the FACT that there are no less than 3 documents that tell us the use of tobacco products is not allowed! Those are a Rule Book we abide by, a USAW Coaches Code of Conduct, USD232 School District Policy, etc....

If you want to use the products there is, and will be a penalty. That penalty is ejection for Flagrant Misconduct.

Ejection from any tournament also carries with it an 8 day suspension from the sport.

Means no appearance in the wrestling room and no Tournaments.


This topic has gotten a little more life than I thought it would, but now many more people are aware of the RULE! That was my intent.

Have a good day.


Jeff
Posted By: toughguy Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/05/09 02:29 PM
even though i do chew, i DO NOT do it on school grounds!!!!!
Posted By: bockman Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/05/09 07:03 PM
Its not about when and where. If that is the rule then maybe just try and follow the rules. Just because you bend the rules a little bit it does not make you cool. So if the tournament director says no chewing, spitting, yelling, drinks in the gym I guess its up to you if you want to be asked to leave or not. Thats my opinion.
Posted By: usawks1 Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/05/09 09:58 PM
Again, as a few have noted and Richard Salyer supplied ... there is a State statutue that is being violated if you chew on public school property!

Most districs have a policy against, drinks or coolers in the gym!
Posted By: sportsfan02 Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/05/09 10:36 PM
Originally Posted By: usawks1
Again, as a few have noted and Richard Salyer supplied ... there is a State statutue that is being violated if you chew on public school property!

Again, it is NOT on the property but rather IN the buildings according to state statutes. Some schools have their own rules that prohibit tobacco use on all their property some don't.
Posted By: usawks1 Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/05/09 10:51 PM
I mis-stated! My apologies!!
Posted By: Conrad1 Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/06/09 06:44 AM
Whos job is it to watch this.Because the refs cant be babysitters do you leave it up to the head of the tournment or what. Who watchs on the high school level the ad or Princpal.who?? Being a wrestler for many years at all levels i have seen it in done at high school and college locker rooms and even as a coach once or twice. I myself am a dipper so i say you leave it up to the coachs to police themselves and members of their team/family whoever.Unless at every tournment theres a poor sucker who has to go around and do mouth checks and what not.
Posted By: DamonParker Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/06/09 01:38 PM
Originally Posted By: Coach C
Who watchs on the high school level the ad or Princpal.who??


For the most part, at the high school level coaches are mature and respectful enough to where it is not an issue.
Originally Posted By: DamonParker
Originally Posted By: Coach C
Who watchs on the high school level the ad or Princpal.who??


For the most part, at the high school level coaches are mature and respectful enough to where it is not an issue.


Darn, immature disrespectful kids coaches. When I grow up I want to be a high school coach.
Posted By: DamonParker Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/06/09 03:10 PM
I'm not saying that all kids coaches are immature and disrespectful, but I don't recall seeing a 7 page thread on this topic on the high school board!
Originally Posted By: DamonParker
I'm not saying that all kids coaches are immature and disrespectful, but I don't recall seeing a 7 page thread on this topic on the high school board!


And eight of the repies are from you! I think that coaches in High School are more concerned about there athletes obeying rules, staying eligible & winning duals & tournaments then what another grown man has in his mouth!
Posted By: DamonParker Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/06/09 06:18 PM
You get the last word, Pat. I'm done with this one.
Posted By: usawks1 Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/06/09 06:36 PM
Most High School coaches are fully aware of the rules and contracts they have signed. It takes a coach with a pretty cavalier attitude to ignore the ethic clauses most have signed!
Posted By: nix Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/06/09 06:38 PM
well at least one good thing has come out of this topic, i quit smoking yesterday, have not had one since and i am done for good.

bad thing is my wife made me join her and 2 other women in our local biggest loser contest, great time to quit smoking and start a workout program.
Posted By: luellen Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/06/09 06:43 PM
NIX, your gonna end up dying for no good reason.
Posted By: windjammer Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/06/09 07:19 PM
People will be talking at your funeral about how healthy you look.
Posted By: Director007 Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/06/09 07:38 PM
Would wearing the nicotine patch count as a violation, or puffing on a plastic nicotine inhaler to curb the need !! Or is it only limited to certain digestion methods ? ..... I dont smoke or chew " anymore " and frankly cant stand walking into a tournament at 6am and smelling all the beautiful toxins right in front of the entry door..... And Im sure the kids dont care for it either. After all, its an event for them not for the adults and a little respect for others always goes a long ways... my 2 peso's worth.

" grabs paddle to give the pot one last stir " lol
Posted By: nix Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/06/09 09:50 PM
oh the famous windjammer has set his sails again i was just wondering where you had been good to hear from you. and of course michael luellen. gotta say last year was a little funner with you two always on here. but we have some new comics as well that keep it intersting.

well i have the weight to lose let's hope wind and michael are wrong about the dying and funeral. lol
Posted By: nix Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/06/09 10:09 PM
and what does having 7 pages realy have to do with anything i believe jeff brodbent and patrickcavanaugh and randy and so many others have made some great points on both sides of this debate.

so if we end up with 30 pages everyone's being cival and making some good points.

now it's time for a smoke and cookie, just playing don't tell my wife i almost had a weak moment. (ALMOST)
Posted By: ReDPloyd Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/07/09 12:43 AM
windjammer,

Awesome avatar! Sure beats that creepy caped thing we saw last year (just kidding, kind of). I can't watch it long though, it makes me a little dizzy. I am sure that all of us have wanted to bang our heads during kids' wrestling tournaments. I thought that I would give you a great tune to bang your head to. This was a favorite group of mine to listen to on the way to high school wrestling duals and tournaments. Cut and paste to your browser and enjoy the music. Rock on Quiet Riot.

[url=Ihttp://www.actionext.com/names_q/quiet_riot_lyrics/bang_your_head.html]Ihttp://www.actionext.com/names_q/quiet_riot_lyrics/bang_your_head.html[/url]

I'm an axe grinder, pile driver
Mama says that I never, never mind her
Got no brains, I'm insane
The teacher says that I'm one big pain
I'm like a lazer, six string razor
I've got a mouth like an alligator
I want it louder, more power
I'm gonna rock it till it strikes the hour
Chorus
Bang your head
Metal health will drive you mad
Bang your head
Metal health will drive you mad
I'm frustrated and out-dated
I really wanna be over-rated
I'm a finder and I'm a keeper
I'm not a loser, and I ain't no weeper
I got the boys to make the noise
Won't ever let up, hope it annoys you
Join the pack fee the crack
Well now you're here, there's no way back!!!!!!
Chorus
Metal health will cure your crazy
Metal health will cure your mad
Metal health is what we all need
It's like a heart attack!!!!!!!
Bang your head wake the dead
We're all metal mad, its all you have
So bang your head and raise the dead oh yeah
Metal health it drives you mad, mad, mad, mad
Chorus
(Over chorus to fade..)
Ah get your straightjackets on tonight ohh
The bad boys are gonna set you right
Oh rock ya, rock ya, rock ya
Posted By: ReDPloyd Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/07/09 12:57 AM
OK, try this link instead. It even comes with a video.

http://new.music.yahoo.com/videos/QuietRiot/Bang-Your-HeadMental-Health--2146234
Posted By: bockman Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/07/09 01:02 AM
dangit nix i told you to stay off those darn cookies or it will turn you into the pillsbury dough boy.
Posted By: jhbmlbx2 Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/07/09 03:30 AM
I had to get in on this one my first post. If you believe a rule is a rule, are you going to start ejecting people after the announcement made at EVERY turny PLEASE SIT DOWN NO ONE IS TO BE AT THE MAT SIDE EXCEPT COACHES AND WRESTLERS ON DECK. I for one would be happy to leave if any of my behavior is against the rules but you have to remove EVERY ONE ELSE TOO for all their miss behavior. You can not have your cake and eat it too. Be a good sport is more important than tobacco. As I see it this is one rule that is not going to change you would have to get the state on board.
Posted By: Jeff Broadbent Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/08/09 03:26 AM
jhbmlbx2 -

Read the entire thread.

Then let me know if you dont understand the fact that the use of tobacco products is strictly prohibited by NFHS RuleBook.
Posted By: Spexy Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/08/09 05:36 AM
Good Lord, give a rest a dip of chew isn't that big of deal....There are alot of other issues going on in a day than chewing......For instance sportmanship, saw a match today 2 good kids wrestled, after the match the looser popped the winner in the face, Why is it okay for certain (CLUB!!!) to get away with it, without any consiqunces? Just a question, looking for decent answer
Posted By: jafo14 Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/08/09 07:01 AM
I bet we can all guess the club!
Posted By: themat Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/08/09 12:26 PM
Yes, I agree with all. I smoke and I do my best to keep too acouple and I walk away from all doors, most the time I walk out to my truck. We are adults and we are going to smoke. This is not the answer but they need a butt can outside away from doors and they wouldn't have Butts on the ground after. If I can't smoke inside then they shouldn't be able to Chew either.
Posted By: Bones1768 Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/08/09 02:51 PM
What about the chewing tobacco that doesn't contain nicotine. I have a friend who chews this, to break himself of skoal. Is this alright at wrestling tournaments? I'm not trying to be a smarta** either, just wanting to know peoples opinion on this.
Posted By: John Johnson Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/09/09 12:53 AM
I hate chewing gum worse, kids leave it on the bleachers, terrible. It doesn't contain tobacco - its legal - will Jeff have to look at the can to see what it is. If you have thrown away the can are you out, or will your word be acceptable. And, after watching some ref's today, don't you think they should really stay focused on the action on the mat!!!!!!!! As if we all do not have important things to deal with.
Posted By: jhbmlbx2 Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/09/09 01:01 AM
Sure I got it but what about all the other violations that are happening at EVERY turny??? If you are going to teach the straight and narrow live by the arrow!! what I am getting at is double standards. We should all be striving for to fallow the rule but not blindly.
Posted By: Jeff Broadbent Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/09/09 02:51 PM
Originally Posted By: John Johnson
I hate chewing gum worse, kids leave it on the bleachers, terrible. It doesn't contain tobacco - its legal - will Jeff have to look at the can to see what it is. If you have thrown away the can are you out, or will your word be acceptable. And, after watching some ref's today, don't you think they should really stay focused on the action on the mat!!!!!!!! As if we all do not have important things to deal with.



John,

Dont know if this is a slam at me or what, but...

For the record.

I will point out to a referee any coach who is using tobacco at a kids wrestling tournament. No, I will not go out of my way to identify these coaches, but if you are in my vicinity or coaching against me and are using chew, I will make it known.

I have done so the last 2 days at Pittsburg and at St. James. To the young referees credit at St. James who told the offender to leave I applaud your knowledge of the RULEBOOK. To the referee the day before, who came up to me later and admitted that he made a mistake by not removing the coaches, I know you were in a tough spot, amongst friends.

UNTIL the referees begin to take control of this situation it will continue to happen. There is no need for it in our sport and it is a terrible example to set for young athletes who look up to their coaches.

For coaches who get upset with "me" regarding this issue and have the desire to belittle me in front of all involved. I am a grown man and will listen to your words as long as there is no profanity used.

I for one do consider this a very important topic and I will not back down.

I will continue to point out those I run across at these kids tournaments. Even (and especially) if "there are 40 or 50 others doing the exact same thing!"... A quote from a parent/coach matside.


Jeff Broadbent - MVWC
Hey Jeff, can I get your clubs itinerary for the remainder of the year?
Posted By: Jeff Broadbent Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/09/09 06:19 PM
A chewer, huh??!!

Jeff
Originally Posted By: Jeff Broadbent
A chewer, huh??!!

Jeff


Only when no one is looking. I found it curious at a tournament yesterday they announced no chewing, so I immediately walked to the front door & huddled around the front door were 6 people smoking.
Posted By: Beeson Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/09/09 08:08 PM
Do you seriousely want to throw this on the Refs? They have a hard enough time keeping two coaches to a corner, and the mats clear.

Look, I am sick and tired of seeing this post. If Jeff wants to make this his own personal crusade...so be it. For those of you who chew...continue to do so and hide it...but please stop responding so this post will DIE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Posted By: Jeff Broadbent Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/09/09 08:26 PM
Beeson - like the attitude. Simply brilliant.

The refs are the ones who are expected to "enforce" the rules of the rulebook.
Back to page 1, but you guys are good! The gauntlet has been layed down!
Posted By: Jeff Broadbent Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/09/09 09:00 PM
Patrick,

you just wasted all of beesons hard work in one little keystroke!! :-)
Posted By: Beeson Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/09/09 09:01 PM
Your killing me...that was 5 minutes of my life I'll never get back. If I chewed, I would need a dip right now. KMAC have one for me ole buddy...we tried.
Posted By: KMac Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/09/09 09:34 PM
Beeson, Jeff, and all the rest of you........I'm putting in a super-sized one now!!!!!!!!

Beeson - we make a pretty good tag team even if it was short lived.
I firmly believe that each person has the right to make their own decisions but when an adult is chewing during a wrestling tournament while working at the table, I think this needs to be addressed! This happened on Mat 5 in McPherson this last weekend. My son was checked in by a gentleman who was chewing and spitting in the gym! What kind of example is that?
Posted By: John Johnson Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/10/09 02:28 AM
Thats the point 'Wrestlingsmylife' I am not asking that guy working the table to be my son's role model. That's quite a burden because it something different in each person's eyes. I just want the 'volunteer' to keep the score right. If we are asking all coaches to be perfect examples, boy there should be one or two left buy the time we set the criteria. How about channeling the energy wasted on this crusade and change it to where Jr. High kids have a full season and can do federation as well.
Posted By: my3sons Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/10/09 02:56 AM
I've been reading this post the last couple of days. Both sides have some good post, but being involved with kids wrestling for 15 years I can tell you people this is a small issue to some. There is going to be way bigger problems to deal with then a coach chewing or a table worker chewing or coach smoking. I have 3 sons that have been involved with kids wrestling, a 11,16 & 18 year old. I don't chew or smoke and nor do my older kids. They have had coach's that have chewed and never once have they ever mentioned that was a problem to me. Yes I have talked to them about the dangers of both and they know as well. Just wait tell your kids get cars, girlfriends, and are out on a Saturday night. When you put things in perspective, some things are more important. I know the rules state that a coach cannot chew at matside. Most people couldn't tell if a coach is chewing or not. I think this topic needs to be put to rest and good luck to all this year.
Posted By: mmeditz Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/10/09 03:14 AM
My parents smoke, my wifes parents smoke. My kids know that it is bad and they express concern for gma and gpas health. My wife nor I smoke and because of the way we have raised our children, I'm 99.99% sure none of the 4 will pick up a cigarette. My kids won't get in a car without putting on their seatbelt even when I don't.

My point is that we as parents set the standards that our children need to adhere to. When we walk through a crowd outside of school smoking, my kids arent blind, they see it. Does it make them want to light up? No. If they see someone with a dip in does that make them want to try it? No. I'm not saying that its ok to break the rules, I'm just saying that if you are parenting your kids properly alot of that stuff is not a factor.

This thread is getting ridiculously long. Like others before me have said, if your gonna eject the chewers, you gotta start ejecting everyone, no matter how small the infraction. I agree with my3sons and Beeson, put this thread to rest.
Posted By: in it to win it Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/10/09 03:19 PM
The worse thing I did probably was for role modeling was send my older kid to ISU camp to work with Cael....both the same weight both fodder for practice and drilling instructions---he came back that Sr. year knowing just how to chew...

Not knocking Cael at all....Cael can rock the house and universe...it's just that habits are hard to break...and there must be something about chewing that sticks with a few that can't deny it.

This post has sparked a great deal of controversy but has led most readers to becoming more educated in the rule. Consensus has to be that if you are going to chew -- to take care of where your doing it.
Posted By: clarkmom Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/14/09 01:16 AM
This is probably the most ridiculous post that I have ever read. If it's not hurting you then why are you so worried about it. Yes, it is a bad habit, but no one is craming it down your throat. I have seen much worse things over the years, than to worry about a person chewing and spitting in a bottle. For instance, (1) a coach arguing with a ref, so lets just teach the kids to disrespect the ref, and to tell everyone how he got screwed. (2) a child who loses, and throws his/her head gear or punches the mat. (3) how about a coach/parent that cusses. (4) my son was recently wrestling, and his opponents coach was yelling,"ruff him up!" Come on, my son is 10 years old! (5)Parents yelling and screaming on the side of the mat, when asked several times to sit down, because it is actually affecting someone else, you know the people who can't see because they are actually sitting up in the stands where they are supposed to be. You know, "obeying the rules."

I think that people really need to pick their battles more carefully. I know that our coaches volunteer their time, and most of the time don't get a break to eat, let alone go outside to chew. I don't think that I would want to be around a coach, who has volunteered their whole day to coach my son, and not let him get a fix from chew.

I chose my battles wisely, and this is not one of them. Those who have the time to go around and try to find everyone who is chewing, to try to get them kicked out obviously don't have enough on their plate during the tournaments.
Posted By: Beeson Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/14/09 01:56 AM
cryWhy? Why? Why?...Why won't this thread DIE?...Why? Why? Why? cry
Posted By: lynseywebb Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/14/09 02:14 AM
Because people like you respond to it...
Posted By: Jeff Broadbent Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/14/09 04:26 AM
Sorry guys, but I do have to respond...

It is not "just a bad habit."
It is a "violation of a rule" that is in the Rulebook we abide by. Don't try to pick and choose which rules we want to abide by.

For instance remarks -

Rules in place to deal with all of these, except maybe #4?? Dont know what you want to do on this one?? Just need to enforce the penalties.

For the record there are many quality coaches out there who dont need a "fix" from chew. Just as there are many quality coaches who are breaking a rule by using tobacco products.

As far as the following quote -

"I chose my battles wisely, and this is not one of them. Those who have the time to go around and try to find everyone who is chewing, to try to get them kicked out obviously don't have enough on their plate during the tournaments." - clarkmom

As I said earlier. I do not go around looking for those breaking the rules, but if you come to a mat and are doing so, it will be pointed out, in the appropriate way, to an official.
Posted By: clarkmom Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/14/09 06:15 AM
I understand that this is a high school rule, but as said on other posts there is a lot of other little rules that need to be dealt with also then. And since it is a high school rule I guess it is ok to chew at State in the Expocenter since it is not a high school. And now the arguement for that is "its not good to do in front of the kids", Well neither is sitting around at the Holidome drinking beer in front of the kids, and there is a lot of people guilty of that, probably even ones that are talking down on chewing. But no one is complaining about that, I know I have personally seen a lot of people at the Holidome and other hotel stays for big tournaments where there is people sitting around drinking and getting drunk in front of these same young wrestlers. Now I don't know about you, but I think that is a lot worse than chewing.
Posted By: nix Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/14/09 06:35 AM
i believe all this it's bad for the kids is bs. i mean me and my wife are good enough parents to teach our kids right from wrong and my kids are smart enough to not see somthing and try it.

i mean the other day spongebob was on and he littered out the window my kids were watching and guess what when they got in the car the did not litter.

phelps the olymic swimmer just got caught with a bong i would be willing to bet that there is not a rise in swimmers with bongs.

as parents we need to take the responsablity for what are kids do and not blame other people for what are kids saw.

because if thats the case i would not take your child to walmart or the movies because they will see worse people and worse things done then they will ever see at a wrestling meet or hotel.jmo sry beeson had to post one more time lol.
Posted By: Mike Furches Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/14/09 09:15 AM
Let me ask a few questions which don't seem to have been answered yet:

Who, and how do we decide which rules in the rule book to enforce, and not enforce?

Who makes those decisions?

Has this rule been modified for kids wrestling?
Posted By: ReDPloyd Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/14/09 09:50 AM
Mike,

You are up kind of early aren't you? You must be going to a wrestling tournament today. I was just thinking about what a great day today is. I have worked twelve straight days (10 at work and a guard drill weekend in between), and I feel like a kid in a candy store. Today, I get to go watch my son wrestle, and I get to watch many of your sons and daughters wrestle as well. Does it get any better than that? After spending last year across the big pond, aside from being away from my lovely wife and four sons, wrestling was the thing that I missed the most. Believe me hard core wrestling fans, it doesn't get any better than this. If someone cracks a cold one in front of my son and spits tobacco on my shoe, I will still be smiling at the end of the day. Why, because I get to go watch a lot of young kids bust their butts on the mat.
Posted By: RichardDSalyer Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/14/09 10:03 AM
Originally Posted By: ReDPloyd
Believe me hard core wrestling fans, it doesn't get any better than this. If someone cracks a cold one in front of my son and spits tobacco on my shoe, I will still be smiling at the end of the day. Why, because I get to go watch a lot of young kids bust their butts on the mat.
I may take offense to someone spitting on my Nocona Lizards however I do agree it does not get any better than this. This morning at 7:00 A.M. I will be handling the GWAL City League weigh-ins, then will travel to assist with the Pioneer League Middle School Junior Varsity Tournament, then back to Wichita Heights for the City League finals. My wife will certainly disagree, but today, life is good.

Providing opportunities for kids!
Posted By: Mike Furches Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/14/09 10:36 AM
Originally Posted By: ReDPloyd
Mike,

You are up kind of early aren't you? You must be going to a wrestling tournament today. I was just thinking about what a great day today is. I have worked twelve straight days (10 at work and a guard drill weekend in between), and I feel like a kid in a candy store. Today, I get to go watch my son wrestle, and I get to watch many of your sons and daughters wrestle as well. Does it get any better than that? After spending last year across the big pond, aside from being away from my lovely wife and four sons, wrestling was the thing that I missed the most. Believe me hard core wrestling fans, it doesn't get any better than this. If someone cracks a cold one in front of my son and spits tobacco on my shoe, I will still be smiling at the end of the day. Why, because I get to go watch a lot of young kids bust their butts on the mat.


Hey Lee, up about usual time actually, maybe an hour early at most. All other things said, some good stuff. After doing those late night shifts in the past, I am enjoying sleeping at night now. While my day won't be as full as Richards, I will enjoy a HS tournament at Remington. Wrestling is a great sport, and we can enjoy the freedom of going to a tournament today, hopefully all of us doing something positive for the kids we are with.
Posted By: BLT Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/14/09 01:15 PM
Now I like the direction this thread has taken.
Yes, people will break some rules and Yes, it is everyones right to call them out on them if they notice it.
Yes, Beeson will be upset that people are still replying to this thread.
Yes, as much as I think it has gotten a little blown out of proportion, I will continue to read it.
Why is all of this happening???
We are all expressing (in our own way) our passion for this great sport.
Thanks to all of you for your enjoyable comments & your passion for this sport.
Its time to wrestle. Enjoy your Valentines day! Try to love everyone today as much as you love wrestling and I promise it will be a great day for us all!
Posted By: 5G's Dad Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/15/09 02:20 AM
Lee,

I appreciate your wisdom as we got to spend another day enjoying the big picture. It is in no small part, due to the men like you who sacrifice time with your family to spend it "across the pond" that allows us the privilege of pointing out the details of the rules to one another. The rest of us can go about contributing our best (and some of our worst) to our youth, with the most part being for their good.

I was at a tournament in Missouri today and had at least 4 folks chewing tobacco walk in front of me to spit in the trash...and I didn't know if it was against MO High school or kids rules, but couldn't help but think of this thread and giggle. And I kept my opinion to myself, just like I did when I walked past 4 smokers in front of the school. But I wouldn't have minded if someone else would have spoken up...
Posted By: Packerholic4 Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/15/09 07:17 AM
Can we get rid of this subject!! just don't use the stuff around the kids. chew some gum or just take a break from coaching.
Posted By: Conrad1 Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/18/09 03:57 AM
LET THIS FORUM DIE!!!!
Posted By: Beeson Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/18/09 04:10 AM
I don't care anymore...it had been 2 days since someone posted. And then BLAM!!!!!!!!!!!! It's brought right back to the top, just to ask for it to DIE. I will be bumping this topic every night until State at 9:00 pm. Long live this TOPIC.
Posted By: RichardDSalyer Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/18/09 08:34 AM
Senate Bill 25 - Kansas Indoor Clean Air Act

The amended bill passed the Kansas Senate on 02/17/2009 by a vote of:
Yeas 26
Nays 13

The bill is supported by your Governor however it does face an uncertain future in the Kansas House of Representatives.
Posted By: RichardDSalyer Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/18/09 08:40 AM
Also on the Legislative agenda is the Kansas Nonsmoker Protection Act. Senate Bill 81 was introduced on January 22, 2009 and has been referred to the Public Health and Welfare committee of the Kansas Senate.

Kansas Nonsmoker Protection Act
[quote=RichardDSalyer
The bill is supported by your Governor however it does face an uncertain future in the Kansas House of Representatives. [/quote]

No wonder Kansas can't make payroll, not to mention the IOU's that those of you lucky enough to get a tax refund will be getting in place of a check.
Posted By: S McFee Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/18/09 01:18 PM
maybe if the legislatures worried about what is causing the problem rather than trying to interfere with tobacco use, they could balance a budget!

as someone who does chew, here is a recommendation. If you arent man enough to swallow it, dont chew it!
Originally Posted By: oldguy1979
maybe if the legislatures worried about what is causing the problem rather than trying to interfere with tobacco use, they could balance a budget!

as someone who does chew, here is a recommendation. If you arent man enough to swallow it, dont chew it!


Gut it or Shut it!
Posted By: luellen Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/18/09 02:39 PM
If you chew dont spew!
Posted By: Beeson Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/19/09 02:01 AM
Beeson's 9:00 Bump.
Posted By: BLT Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/19/09 12:15 PM
Beeson
Will this be a 9am & a 9pm BUMP or are you only going to do this once a day? JC!
Posted By: Beeson Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/19/09 12:26 PM
BLT

Come on, twice a day, don't you think that would be a little excessive. The last thing this topic needs is for someone to go overboard. I think just once a day would keep it a legitimate topic that people would take serious.

Respectfully,

Chad
Posted By: BLT Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/19/09 06:15 PM
Chad
When your right, you are right!
Thanks for keeping this "IMPORTANT" topic top of mind for us all!
When you stop bumping it is when I will know that it is finally dead and I will stop checking it!

Again,
THANK YOU
Posted By: luellen Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/19/09 06:42 PM
You already got cavanaughs monkey in copenhagen withdraw what more do you people want? Give it a rest.
Posted By: Beeson Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/20/09 02:00 AM
It's 9:00, Time to empty your spittoons everybody. Cavanaugh, Time to change your monkey's nicotine patch.
Posted By: bockman Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/20/09 02:09 AM
ok thats it. i am starting back up. all this talk about chewing, chewing, chewing. its the pressure i just cant take it anymore. im surrounded by it. i am going to blame all you guys for making me start up again. thats my story i will be telling my wife and im sticking to it.
Posted By: Owlbacker Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/20/09 01:40 PM
Originally Posted By: bockman
ok thats it. i am starting back up. all this talk about chewing, chewing, chewing. its the pressure i just cant take it anymore. im surrounded by it. i am going to blame all you guys for making me start up again. thats my story i will be telling my wife and im sticking to it.


Hey Bockman, there have been a lot of threads about cutting weight, Ignore this one like you do those.....you will be fine
Posted By: usawks1 Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/20/09 02:19 PM
LOL
Originally Posted By: Beeson
Cavanaugh, Time to change your monkey's nicotine patch.


Everyones concern for monkey is heartwarming. Unfortunately, this has all been too much for the little guy to handle. I found monkey this morning & well let's just say his avatar is now a memorial. I knew I shouldn't have let him on this thread again but I did & I will have to live with that. Let this be a warning about the evils of chewing tobacco. Forget all the other rules violations that before today seemed to be much more important then chewing. Jeff you are right, chewing is the main problem on Saturdays during wrestling season. Not the cutting weight, not the language that our little wrestlers hear,not the verbal or physical abuse that some competitors have to put up with, not even the alcohol consumption by a coach (dad) that these innocent little wrestlers may be subject to after a 10 hour day in a gym. It is chewing that we should all be concerned about. Thanks to all for making me see the light, if only monkey could have!
Posted By: crowdad Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/20/09 03:23 PM
I am just happy the little monkey didnt go off on you, or maybe not.
Posted By: Beeson Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/20/09 03:54 PM
Originally Posted By: PatrickCavanaugh
Originally Posted By: Beeson
Cavanaugh, Time to change your monkey's nicotine patch.


Everyones concern for monkey is heartwarming. Unfortunately, this has all been too much for the little guy to handle. I found monkey this morning & well let's just say his avatar is now a memorial.


Patrick, I said CHANGE the patch, not ADD another one.
Posted By: Jeff Broadbent Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/20/09 06:17 PM
Patrick,

FYI - You are mistaken, I never said it was the main problem on Saturdays...

You are correct though, in the fact that there are other concerns as well.

Several of those other things are also addressed in the Rule Book that you evidently want to pick and choose which rules to abide by.

My suggestion is to follow all of the rules, and you will be okay.

BTW - Just keep responding and it will continue to be seen by all who visit, if they choose to read this thread.

That was the point of the thread. To inform the many coaches who were uninformed of the rule, or for those that knew of the rule, that there may be consequences for their actions.
Originally Posted By: Jeff Broadbent
Patrick,

FYI - You are mistaken, I never said it was the main problem on Saturdays...

You are correct though, in the fact that there are other concerns as well.

Several of those other things are also addressed in the Rule Book that you evidently want to pick and choose which rules to abide by.

My suggestion is to follow all of the rules, and you will be okay.

BTW - Just keep responding and it will continue to be seen by all who visit, if they choose to read this thread.

That was the point of the thread. To inform the many coaches who were uninformed of the rule, or for those that knew of the rule, that there may be consequences for their actions.


Blah, Blah, Blah.
Posted By: dagwood Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/20/09 10:12 PM
This post should be a permanent fixture at the top of the board because obviously it is the biggest thing going on in kids wrestling right now.
Posted By: mmeditz Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/20/09 10:59 PM
ten pages....wow! you can't even go back far enough to find a topic that had 10 pages of comments.
Posted By: ReDPloyd Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/21/09 12:41 AM
Patrick,

Step away from the monkey, leave the monkey alone. After all, I believe that I am the sarrogate father to this monkey. Below you will see one of your posts, the first post in which the monkey appeared. I was overseas and thought that the avatar gave a little personality to the people who were participating in the forum.

"DPloyd4Now, for your entertainment, I've reduced myself to a guitar playing monkey!"

By the way Patrick, I busted my tail finding this quote, but it was worth it. The rabid guitar playing monkey gave me a lot of laughs while I was gone. Please let him continue to exist. I hope that others will join the avatar path.

My last comment is this, and this is the original point of my last post on this subject. Try leaving the sport for a year. Don't go to any practices, or any tournaments. Most of you are as addicted to this sport as some people are to alcohol and tobacco. We are all as rabid as Patrick's monkey at times. Once again Patrick, please don't put the monkey down. He is one of my fondest memories while I was away.
Posted By: Beeson Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/21/09 02:59 AM
I want to apologize for not bumping at 9:00. It was my dad's birthday and we went out for dinner. I will do my best to be punctual from now on.

If the monkey can be saved please do so. I am willing to donate to the cause. If leaving this topic alone will save the monkey I will stop cold turkey tonight.
Posted By: BLT Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/21/09 03:02 AM
SAVE THE MONKEY!!!!
Posted By: ReDPloyd Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/21/09 03:06 AM
SAVE THE MONKEY!!!!!!!!!!!!PLEASE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Posted By: my12floz Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/21/09 03:14 AM
kill the topic!!!!!!!!!!!!
Posted By: nix Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/21/09 03:45 AM
beeson thats no excuse, carry a laptop so you never let that happen again.

and as far as the monkey goes maybe you need to have a a carwash with all proceeds donated to him.
Posted By: 2bentleymom Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/22/09 04:49 AM
not sure on that one beeson but I do know if any of you need a fix at a tournament and are out no need to go to the store my husband michael always has it in his pocket and spare in the car..
Posted By: Mike Furches Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/22/09 06:28 PM
While I have expressed myself on the rules, are we at the point yet where we can talk about favorite chews? Then there is another question, it seems like a lot of wrestlers, and baseball players chew, is that a fair assumption or not? Chad, I hope I didn't steal your daily bump, but I thought since no one ever answered any of the questions I did ask, that maybe someone might respond to questions of a different nature.

Now before some get too excited, I have been known to take a chew every now and then, I may be on of the few that has actually worked in Tobacco, from cutting to hanging it, and then going to auctions where it is sold. I have taken a dip or two in my life, and taken more than a few chews in my life, which I prefer over dipping, although I haven't chewed any tobacco products in over a year and a half. Anyway, I will open the discussion for those questions asked above.
Posted By: Beeson Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/22/09 09:36 PM
Mike, Apparently my daily bump yesterday was too colorful, as it is no longer there.

I have only taken one dip in my entire life, and it ended so poorly that I can honestly say I do not have a favorite.

Will coaches, refs, and table workers be able to chew at State since we will not be on school property?
Posted By: 2bentleymom Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 02/23/09 06:11 AM
Not sure what the differences are for I have never chewed but my husband dipped copenhagen until I got pregnant then the smell made me sick so he went to skoal long cut wintergreen until he found out red seal long cut wintergreen was cheaper and tasted the same..
Posted By: meb Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 03/03/09 09:43 PM
Just a fast note. I would rather see a chew in than 5 ear rings and a steel pipe in a mans ear.
Posted By: clong Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 03/04/09 04:31 PM
Copenhagen is the only chew for me!
Posted By: win by pin Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 03/04/09 06:42 PM
Will there be chewing alloud at the Wichita classic ? After all it is Not a school building. Animals even crap on the floor at that place.
Posted By: Jeff Broadbent Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 03/04/09 07:04 PM
Remember what the Rule Book says.

Would hate for any of you to miss Subs!!!
Posted By: sportsfan02 Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 03/04/09 07:33 PM
We used to have a district director who was a fanatic about the use of tobacco at tournaments. Of couse all the while he was doing this he was robbing our district coffers.
Originally Posted By: Jeff Broadbent
Remember what the Rule Book says.

Would hate for any of you to miss Subs!!!



Exactly why we're staying home this weekend. Instead of chewing at a tournament we're going to have a keg party with a bunch of wild folk. Much better influence on our wrestlers!
Will be selling wrist bands for $5.00 or one can of copenhagen long cut.
Posted By: win by pin Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 03/06/09 03:21 AM
If I buy 2 wrist bands can I have a cold one for each hand.
Posted By: wrstlmom1970 Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 03/15/09 12:40 AM
I totally agree with the no chew at matside or inside our school buildings, but what I am very disappointed with after going to sub-districts today, was the language used by some of the coaches towards their wrestlers. If we are suppose setting good examples and mentors for these wrestlers, maybe we should clean up our language also.
I am new to this, but do have something to say & it is not all about wrestling.

It seems to me that the rules are put into place for everyone to follow. but for some unknown reason we tell our kids do as I say not as I do, we are suppose to be setting an example for our kids & if we as parents, coaches refs or whom ever we are that the kids see us not following the rules set before us all then why should we expect them to follow them? we get upset with them when they do not & they get into trouble for not following the rules. We need to lead by example in all areas of our lives for our kids.

this last weekend we found a cup that was left in the stands w/spit in it from some one chewing & it had been steppped on. That is just down right disgusting to me. If you are going to do this be responsible enough to clean up after yourself. Show the kids how to be respectful not destructive. I have seen trash left in the stands all the time because no one wants to be responsible for themselves & CLEAN UP after your sleves. Have some respect for the school you are in as well. this could be your own childs school!!!!

I make my children clean up after themselves & put things where they go & that is in the trash not the floor or the stands.

the other thing is why is it that we let the kids run up & down the bleachers & jumping, by the time we get done after a full day of wrestling I have one heck of a headache because the kids are running up,down,jumping & stomping up & down the stairs. Have some condiseration for others where that is concerned. I have seen many of the kids running & chasing one another during the meets & the parents are oblivious to this for some reason, when I see my kids doing this & I am sure they are very guilty of it as well, but when I catch them I make them stop. My husband just had double knee replacements & was using a walker & canes & was about ran over by many due to running & no consideration to the fact he was not able to walk normal like most of us. he was there to cheer his kids on just like everyone else was. I have also seen many almost run over others in wheel chairs & canes.

I do realize that they are excited & wound up but we really do need to try to have some sort of control over our kids not just the one wrestling.

This is my opinion which may not amount to much but this is how I feel & it is not just at the wrestling meets that we need to be mindful of how we set the example for our kids!

thanks
Posted By: 3badboyz Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 03/20/09 11:29 AM
Instructions for chewing where you are not supposed to: 1.Go outside to put the dip in. 2. Take a small to generous amount and slide it way back in the jaw. 3. Take your hand press against your lower cheek and flatten it out. 4. Spit once (if necessary) before entering the No tobacco zone. 5. Do not spit anywhere. Remember you the chewer/dipper are in the wrong. Do not spit on the floor, the trash can, a spit cup, nowhere. Hint; stay ahead of the brown juice and swallow a little at a time no problems. 6. When you are ready to dispose of the contraband in your jaw, do not go the the trash can, toilet etc. Go outside to your car or way out in the grass and get rid of the evidence. It will dry up in the grass before it can offend anyone. Remember they can get DNA from saliva so use your own discretion when disposing of your dip.
Now, if you follow these instructions you should not offend anyone, disgust anyone or set a bad example. However, you have broken the rules and should face the consequences if caught. It is not about having a big fatty in and defying the powers that be to confront you. It is about coaching, whatching your kids or working the tournament while enjoying some cope. A little discretion and respect for others should minimize your possibilities of encountering a whole lot of greif. Your risk of mouth or throat cancer will still be just as great.
I beleive there used to some sort of KSHSAA rule way back not allowing HS coaches to be in the same room as the wrestlers they coached in high school when they were participating in kids practices or competitions. What a stupid rule. I am glad it has since been changed. Where was the soap box when that rule was so blantantly ignored by most? Are we all ready to start abiding by the rule book to the letter? I bet I can quit chewing before that all happens. Has anyone ever drummed up a last minute skin form?
Posted By: meb Re: Chewing Tobacco at Tournaments!! - 03/20/09 03:19 PM
There is not a man nor lady alive that dosnt bend or break the rules of some kind.We all pick what is go or bad to us.I for one do not use a seat belt.My kids do,and when they hit 18 they can stop if they would like to.
The hole USA is on the save the dumb people trip.We make rules to save people from them selves.We all know the list after list of laws.
I do not chew BUT I will tell you I will hand a spitter,a cup every time they need one. It is a hole lot better that my kid takes up chewing,then trying to be some gang banger or worse.Maby he will be a kids coach some day.He will need to know how to chew than for sure.
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