Question if you go to a tournament and find that your wrestler is in a combined weight that puts him in a bracket with another wrestler that is 30 to 40 pounds heavier what can you do? If you bring it to their attention and they refuse to change it what can you do if anything?
Usually if you don't want to wrestle that kid cause it is outside the allowable USA Wrestling Guidelines then they will just offer you your money back and send you on your way.
Cause its their right to combine weight classes. When you get into the upper weights its usually more then twenty pounds.
Then you got to decide...
Pack up drive all the way home or wrestle the bigger kid.
It was alway worse in OK cause the max weight is 285.
We've drove all the way down to Stillwater and have had to give over FIFTY pounds or take back our money and go home.
Always watchout for the childs safety FIRST.
Other then that its all about mat time until we get to Subs so I say go for it and use it as a learning tool.
I dont mind giving up 20 pounds but it worries me when our wrestler weighs 100 we send him in at 110 and they combined him with a kid who weighs 170. I just dont think that anyone would stand still for them to combine 61 with 95. Those parents would throw a fit. I guess one thing that bothers me is the attitude that it is ok because they are big boys.
Move him up an age group? Might allow for a closer grouping.
it does seem like too much weight. what is your suggested solution?
both boys travel, weight in, collect medal and then go home?
i would think that as BLT stated that most tournament directors would be open to suggestions, but if they refuse there really isn't anything you can do.
maybe a good practice would be to call before making the trip, make sure they have someone there within your parameters, before you leave the house.
and yes it does stink because it's just because they are big. that isn't always a bad thing though. i still remember my first tournament, it was in OK, i was in the 7th grade 12u, weighed 135 (that was hwt in those days), my first opponent had a slight mustache, and the mark on his arm said 210!! my dad said we didn't come all this way to turn around and drive home, give it your best shot. i hung for 2 1/2 periods, then the difference was too much and i crumbled. my sophmore year i wrestled the same kid i weighed 195 (there wasn't a 215 class then) and this dude weighed 274, i was stronger, smarter, and definitley a better wrestler. i couldn't pin the big boy, but i used my speed, OR rather his complete lack there of, and won 9-2.
use YOUR better judgement then tell your wrestler, that you believe in him/her win/lose/ or "no contest".
I am learning to definately call ahead. Alot of the tournaments do not understand the weight classes in the heavier weights. Most think at 10 and under you go from 130 to heavyweight. They don't look at the USA rules and lump all kids above 130 together. I called on a tournament for next week and this was the case again. Once I talked to the gentleman about it he rebracketed them correctly. This is how it should work. I don't know about most years but there are alot of kids in the 130-150 class this year. No reason to group these kids with the 150-170 kids. It is a safety issue.
Move him up an age group? Might allow for a closer grouping.
Personal Information removed.
Again you forgot to sign your name ALETHEIA.
That is one reason you can view the entries on line for the Oklahoma tournaments. The other reason is so you can see what weight a kid is that you want your son to wrestle that week. It makes for good match ups sometimes.Maybe Kansas could something like this in the future.
40 pounds heavier what can you do?
......
RUN AWAY!!
This stuff makes me laugh. You people would die if you had to wrestle in OK or Missouri or on a National level. OK 10U goes 131lbs to 275lbs. We are 10U & 190+ and often give up 40-50lbs. You learn to adapt or get beat. Safety, while important is not the issue here. I've seen a lot of big weight spread matches and have yet to see anyone get hurt. Seen a lot of kids who were lighter and near or at the same weight get hurt though. I would be more concerned about the crap (literally) that is brought in on the mats from dirty bathrooms on the shoes and the fact that mats are not being sanitized frequently enough or at all. Now those are some serious health and safety concerns.
Another option for everyone worried about "safety" would be to forfeit the match against someone you think is too big or to talented to wrestle. You have that right.
If you think wrestling up is such a good thing all the time, then why bother at all with kids divisions. Pair'em up by weight then let'em go at it. See how long USAWKS lasts after you do that. We get plenty of mat time getting thumped by older boys at practice.
Your correct about asking before you enter your kids in a tournament in KS if you are over 130lbs. Most of the tournaments will try to work with you. However, you should expect to have to wrestle up an age group as the only real option.
One of the neat things about the way OK sets up their series tournaments is that you can see who is going well ahead of time and they do their cut offs on the Wed nights before the tournaments. Usually by then there are enough people listed to give you an idea of what to expect. That really helps if you want to go where you know there will be competition for your wrestler or not.
I think we should encourage tournament directors who use track wrestling to allow us as parents/coaches to be able to view who is going from the time people sign up with est. weights. That way you can make an informed choice wether or not to go to that tournament or not. This makes more sense to me than playing the "Who's here lottery" and then getting rebracketed after you show up. Kids are usually stressed up enough as it is about being there to wrestle, then you go and add they have to wrestle kids 2-3 years older than them or not at all. How is that fair to the kids involved? It isn't, it's about money and trying to pressure people into doing something just to get in some matches at any cost. We played that game for many years, not anymore. If there is any talk of moving us up we collect our money and go to the movies instead.
I saw a 75 pound kid (12U, I'm guessing) from JC last weekend at the Wamego open tournament that got bumped up into the 95 pound bracket. No complaints...he just went out there and wrestled. We was very competitive, too. I saw him go 1-1 but didn't catch any other matches. Kudos to him.
If you think wrestling up is such a good thing all the time, then why bother at all with kids divisions. Pair'em up by weight then let'em go at it. See how long USAWKS lasts after you do that. We get plenty of mat time getting thumped by older boys at practice.
Your correct about asking before you enter your kids in a tournament in KS if you are over 130lbs. Most of the tournaments will try to work with you. However, you should expect to have to wrestle up an age group as the only real option.
i don't think everyone should bump up, that's where YOUR better judgement comes in to play. the point is there are choices, rather than excepting the director's first decision.
and you are definitley right about the "crap" on shoes, skin, hair, etc.
All of those are good ideas. Some of you realize that some kids already wrestle kids who are two or three years older. If they are a young 10 and under and they are wrestling a old 10 and under you could have a 9 year old wrestling a 11 year old. Question are the weight rules something that has to be followed or are they just guidelines or suggestions. As for moving up in age I really don't feel like telling a second year kid that he needs to move up to ten and under just because someone doesn't know the rules. i want it to be fun not scary and painful. Wish there was a easy answer but I know there isn't. guess will we just keep working on it.
Guess I must have missed something on the way to the wrestling mat. I was always under the impression that wrestling is or was supposed to be kinda scary and painful. Bumps, bruises, black eyes, sprains, broken bones and bloody noses are all a part of this sport.
Wrestling is a form of martial arts. That means close quarters hand to hand physical combat w/ a few rules kicked in to keep'em from actually killing each other. If you want to have fun try dance classes. They still might require some physical contact but it's usually in a nice friendly manner. So, if you have a problem emotionally and physically with getting beat up once in awhile or possibly frequently, then wrestling is probably not your sport.
Honestly, don't kid yourself. This is and can be a very dangerous sport regardless of what rules are in place. It only takes 6 lbs of pressure to break a bone in an arm or leg if applied properly.(I got a whole bunch of other simple neat ways to be injured, but for brevity I will refrain from that list.) So it doesn't really matter how big or small you are. You still run the risk of an injury any and every time you step on the mat against anyone, irregardless of the weight differences.
I do respect the kids for their efforts. It takes a ton of guts to dedicate themselves to a sport where they go out on the mats week after week for sometimes 6 to 9 months of practices and/or at tournaments. Fighting all those little natural instincts to run away from confrontation/pain/public humiliation and getting physical with people they often don't know or at best know little of. Toss in the occassional injury and a diet loss regimen and you have one tough kid. Funny thing is, we don't often stop to acknowlege that and see them as they really are.
Three seasons ago my son wrestled Top of 8U 110 and only weight a shade over One Hundred.
Week in and week out they would combine brackets. We always wrestled kids Ten to THIRTY pounds bigger then us. When the state series came around and all we had were kids our own weight class [But still ten pounds bigger] it was rather easy for us. He knew that always wresting bigger kids made him a lot stronger.
Now we are TOP of Ten Under and he only weighs 6 pounds more then he did back then. He has grown into a very different kid physically. But we still sign up every few weeks for an upper weight class to help us stay stronger.
So I guess what I'm trying to say is make the most of it. Use it as a tool not hand cuffs. Take pride that you wrestle bigger kids and hold your own. Cause I promise that three weeks of the year we are all on a level playing field and your son will be much better off for it.
If they are a young 10 and under and they are wrestling a old 10 and under you could have a 9 year old wrestling a 11 year old.
Question are the weight rules something that has to be followed or are they just guidelines or suggestions.
Wish there was a easy answer but I know there isn't. guess will we just keep working on it.
don't get hung up on the age matter, that will never change. in high school you will have young immature 14 year old kids wrestling, 18 year old men. it's not just a wrestling thing either, when your son graduates from college he will be interviewing for jobs, and competing against men/women that have 5-10 years of "real world" experience too!! the thing to do is get it in your head that such is life, and learn to help your child deal with it.
there's rules in place, but tournaments reserve the right to combine weights. that won't happen at the qualifying tournaments or state, but it will everywhere else. the only way is to WORK WITH the director, if NEITHER is willing to compromise, A LITTLE, then there won't be a solution. that will also be there for the rest of time, WE ALL have to give a little to get a little, in life.
THERE IS NO EASY WAY, IN WRESLTING, OR IN LIFE- look at it as a life lesson that you are passing on to a child, as difficult as it is, the earlier those lessons are learned the EASIER it will be to deal with those "real world" /"life" situations that come up.
the trick to all of this is making it understandable to a 10 year old- a few things to try:
-"that which doesn't kill me, will only make me stronger" tell him that bumping up in age/ weight is going to be hard,don't sugar coat it. and that you don't expect him to win, but you do expect him to try as hard as he can, and never give up.
- "a victory no matter how small or insignificant is still a victory"
tell him if you go out and get pinned in the 1st period, say i know it's tough, but we need to work on these few things so you can do better. if he makes to the second period and gets pinned the next time. treat it like it's the state championship. great job son you tried hard, did what we worked on, and you did better than last time. i am so proud. see it's not easy but you can do it.
- i've coached for 15 years had kids excel at a young age and had kids who didn't succeed until the were seniors, and had kids that never really had the success we all hoped for, but this has always kept kids on the team. all of those kids even those THAT DIDN'T STICK WITH IT were better young men/women than before. I AM PROUD OF EVERY LAST ONE OF THEM. I KNOW IT'S NOT EASY.
I am not a beginner at this by no means and do love the sport. I am dealing with parents who have a problem with a kid 50 to 70 lbs heavier. This kid has wrestled kids 30 pounds heavier all year. He has done good with this guys. Did lose to a kid that was 45 lbs heavier. The mom is worried and they have pulled him when he was up agaisnt a state qualifer that was 50 lbs heavier which is their right. Hey Hossu i know about the pain of wrestling I had to pick some teeth out of my oldest sons head one time. It is a hard physical sport and I know this. Trying to help newbies better understand the sport.
so is everybody else on here
I will say this about wrestling heavier kids. my son is one of the 10 and under hwts. this has been my experience. we have wrestled up in age for two yrs. not a good deal. both times i put him in this situation, he had to face kids a fooot taller and more proportionate in weight to their age. it was a bad choice from an inexperienced parent. in his normak age division, we have given up 30 lbs and been beat real bad having 30 lbs on our side. the smaller guys have an advantage. they are faster and more agile. just because a kid has 30 lbs on another kid doesn,t always mean the have the advantage. we must teach all kids to know how to wrestle the lighter kid versus the heavier kid. I would not bracket 130 lb with 170. that was a big mistake. if you are hosting a tournament in kansas, you should know better. i do believe the 10 and under rule is 20 lbs maximum. 8 and under 15 lbs maximum. unless it is agreed upon by both coaches.
dean70 i think that is what bothers me that any kid should have to wrestle some one that is 30 lbs heavier than they are. Cause if your son was 61 pounds they would never expect him to wrestle someone that weighs 90 pounds. It is the same difference in weight. So why is it ok that the big boys are excepted to do it every week.
i don't think it is a weight DISCRIMINATION thing. it's a COMPETITION thing.
i think everyone on here sees your point, but understand that if you are 10 years old and weigh 130lbs the law of averages is going to play against you. if you want to compete, you might have to COMPROMISE.
i haven't read a single post on here where someone thinks it's OK for big boys to wrestle up. BUT WE ALL KNOW THAT OUT OF NECESSITY, IF THEY WANT TO COMPETE, THEY WILL NEED TO BUMP UP.
little guys bump up too, ask around. it's been a few years but we had a 14u that weighed 75lbs- he never wrestled in a bracket less than 95lbs until subs.
But I've also been told to think of it by percent of body weight.
Its still not right but its also why they do it.
Take a kid at 60 pounds... does he wrestle people at 72 at practice. SURE so its the same thing as a 150 pounder wrestling a 180 pounder.
I never did understand all that % body fat stuff as it applies to the weight spread limits. The % body fat criteria to me just applied to how they figured out how to determine the individual weight classes in a division.
Maybe it's just me and my math, but it just appears the weight spread limit numbers are a blanket number or rule of thumb rather than using actual percentages or real math. 15-20lb max rule might work decently for the 2-5lb weight group spreads in the lower weight groups in the kids divisions but when you start getting 10-20lb spreads in the actual weight classes then it sorta turns into a joke. Those 15-20lb max numbers would double or triple at the very least if you followed the math.
It would be interesting to find out where these numbers for max weight limit differences comes from and how it is formulated to apply arbitrarily to a division as a whole. As it stands it is limiting and ill applied.
headup I know we have a 12 and under who wants to wrestle 64 only weighs 61. He has to wrestle up alot also.
the term HWT is a term that has been around since dirt. Back in the day, all upper weight divisions were termed HWT. Whether it was Jr High or High School. And yes, years and years ago our kids upper weight division was labeled as HWT.
We have since changed{many,many moons ago} to the actual weight classes as you see now. Every age division has the 3 upper weights as " Heavy Weight " Brackets. Thus as example, in 8& under the first class of Hwt starts at 95# and goes up 15# to 110# then to 125#. Then the 8&under weights stop there. And the top three weights in each age division do the same thing. Only difference is the weight spred per age division. 15# in 8, 20# in 10, 25# in 12, 30# in 14's and 35# in the new high school division.
Hope this clears things up a little. People are just used to lumping the upper kids into the "HWT" division. The top three in each age division are the "HWT" classes. Where people have to be careful is the fact that all of these weight divisions have exact weight limits on them, example: 125# in 8& under. a wrestler may only weigh 125 or below. we cannot create or fudge up and let an 8 & under kid weighing over 125 compete in the 8&under division. During invitationals he may bump up to 10 & under to compete but when qualifying series comes around, he must adhere to the weight limits in his own age divisions. Got this from a district rep. Found this very intresting because I did not know this. Not sure many people do. Most tournaments don't do this.
i think hossus knows a few things about that, right?
Lose weight or dont wrestle,use your head.
Lose weight or dont wrestle,use your head.
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Lose weight or dont wrestle,use your head.
Another brilliant statement from someone who has no idea of the issues.
HEADSUP; Yup we know quite a bit about all that. I really don't think it is really a mystery either. Most meet director's do know the difference they just don't have a whole lot of options due to the current rules that are in place. Which is why I posted above about the weight spread limits being arbitrary. The twist and the obvious folly of this is that you can always wrestle up in weight, but never down in weight even in state series. If a 10U 120lb kid wanted to wrestle in the 10U 170lb group, nobody would argue the weight difference. Even though the rules would prohibit it. Just goes to show what mentality is out there against the bigger kids in general.
Well I know what the rules are. I also know wnat they should be. I have posted on here before only to get negative responses. there are alot of HWT issues in the state of KS. my son wrestled 8 and under for 2 years. now 10 and under. He cannot qualify for state. he is too big. what is up with that? i can wrestle him up to get mat time but when sub-districts come, he cant play!!!!!that is crazy. Beeson, I heard you were the new district 2 state rep. lets fix this for just a couple kids. thanks, Charles King/Wichita Aztecas
I fully intend to submit a proposal for a change in the by-laws this year which would allow any kid to wrestle up one age group at qualifiers and state.
Sportsfan
That will not fully resolve the issue. Pushing the max weight to 285 will not fully resolve the issue.
Someone is still not going to be happy or someone that falls outside the guideline.
I agree something is better then nothing but I also think there comes a time that if you want it bad enough that you have to take this matter into your own hands and do something about it on a personal level.
That's what we had to start doing 2 years ago.
Is it fair NO.
Is it right NO.
Does my sons love the sport enough to make changes and give the effort it takes to make one of these weight classes YES.
I am a fan of Dean and Hossus and know their kids personally.
But guys...
You got to do something for your kids cause the system just isn't going to.
You have been on here for TWO YEARS fighting the good fight. I just don't see the light at the end of the tunnel.
And I do see it as a form of discrimination cause they NEVER tell a kid he can't go to state cause he's too small even if he's outside the allowed weight varience. NEVER
But we tell these big guys no every year.
That's discrimination.
You lost me. How are my intentions going to effect anyone or anything? I'm not sure what more anyone would want or need?
And I do see it as a form of discrimination cause they NEVER tell a kid he can't go to state cause he's too small even if he's outside the allowed weight varience. NEVER
But we tell these big guys no every year.
That's discrimination.
there is a minimum in high school, enough with the discrimination. no one want to walk up and be handed a medal. sportsfan has the closest thing to a solution, AND i think BLT is on board. WRESTLE UP IN AGE. i know it's not perfect, but there has to be a ceiling, you can't go to 285, if you go every 10-15 pounds there won't be any competition. COMPROMISE has got to come from SOMEWHERE. come up with a better solution and i'm sure we would all listen.
until a better solution comes along, let agree on one thing, it's an IMPROVEMENT!!
OK, so bare with me...
I’m just saying that yes it will help some kids, yes it is an improvement, but it won’t solve the issue. Then it will be why can’t my kid wrestle kids of their own age and maturity level. I got to say that I agree.
I think that in terms of Heavy weight or even light weights (any weight outside of our allowed weight guideline, use the Rossville method of Block bracketing. When the entries for subs come in we look at the state as a whole. If there are 9 kids that are within the guide lines of weight variance then you create a weight bracket for them. I say nine cause that should be the bare minimum for a state bracket so no one just gets a medal. If there is not 9 then we refund their entry fee due to lack of competition. That way NO ONE can say we did not provide an opportunity for a kid of any weight to wrestle. I mean does it get anymore fair then that.
I understand there are some how do we order medals for subs for a class if we don’t know they exist. Well if they end up wrestling we give them to them at state because they will all be going anyway. I’m sure they are more interested in wrestling at state then having a sub district medal on that day.
I don’t know I’m just spit balling here but to me it is our due diligence to provide these kids the OPPORTUNITY to wrestle. And if that OPPORTUNITY does not exist then no one has anyone to blame, we did our best.
By the way,
I did not know there was a minimum in high school. What is that weight?
Also, sorry about the grammer and spelling, this was typed on my phone with no spell check! lol
that's another great solution. i'm sorry if i sound upset. it bothers me when all people want to do is complain, and fail to offer any better solution. the first page of this thread was frustrating. it seems like some people cannot be pleased. don't quote me, just off the top of my head i think the hs minimum is 90lbs to wrestler 103. you can only bump up 2 weight classes too. again not positive, but i believe you actually have to weigh above your certified class to do this. i.e. if i weighed 111 i could not bump from 112 to 125, again not positive on all details, but looking into it.
Well here is what I have a problem with is that the powers that be read this fourm everyday. We have been talking about this for over two years.
They hear what the people of this state are saying and yet we always SEEM to get very little done. That's why I was so excited about Chad Beeson being over D2. Do Chad and I see eye to eye on everything HECK NO but he listens to us and I feel that he addresses issues that people bring to him.
I've never sat in the state mtg {but I intend to} so I can not say with certain what goes on there but the impression I get is that there are all these rules to prohibit change.
If you want to talk at the meeting you have to submit a request by this date or If there is a change you would like to see then you have to send a letter by this date.
I know if it was open forum they would be there for days. But that also tells me that there is a lot of change needed.
Post an agenda of say four major issues two months out. Ok D2 look into what we can do to resolve weight class issue. We find three or four club presidents or other board members that want to be apart of this committee and we start asking questions. WE do the leg work. WE use this forum and any other means and then take the issue to the state mtg and say ok...
This is what we see is a problem.
This is what the majority of the people would like to see happen.
Here is two or three SUGGESTED plans to resolve this.
You look them over and people provide imput and if there is a need for change asked for by the people and a solution we make a change.
Ok
I'm climbing down off my stacks of soap boxes cause they are starting to wobble and I'm way to big to be up this high. lol
There is a need for change here OR AT LEAST LOOK INTO IT AND TELL US WHY WE DONT NEED A CHANGE..
Does it effect the majority of the kids wrestling NO.
But these kids pay their dues with cash as well as sweat and blood.
We accept their sign up fees and entry fees.
So that means they deserve the OPPORTUNITY to wrestle at state.
Salina,s tournament had 8 kids entered at 10 and under HWT. 7 showed up and wrestled a good bracket just like everybody else. 4 0f these 7 kids I know won,t be able to make weight and participate in the state series next year because they are already at 170 right now. they will be good this year but by next year they will be no less than 190. then they wont be able to cut weight and meet 170. and there are so more kids we are talking about. go look at the 8 and under Hwt at maize. Stacked. It wasnt like that last year. Trying to make lighter kids cut weight 1 to 5 is a chore for alot of you. Try asking your 10 year old to cut 25. Charlie/Wichita Aztecas
The thing this year there are alot of novice kids @ HWT , alot are football players. Maybe a closer look at more weight classes to try keep these kids in. Wrestlers make better football players.(maybe)
My point bowen more weight classes more kids wrestle less combining. How many kids don't wrestle because they know they can't go to state? It would be intresting to know. dean70 I have a 10 year old at 130 I couldn't get him to cut 5 pounds let alone 25. So lets talk to our district reps about more weight classes. Do it soon the have a state excus meeting in the next week. They start talking now maybe something can change for next year.
we are from district 2. what district are you from n7m?
so bowen, what is wrong with a bunch of HWT novice footbell players? This would be good for KS football anyway. any 3 of these kids will be top notch KU or Kstate football
The weight classes have been studied to death and the results of those studies are the weight classes that you see. If your kid/kids want to wrestle they will wrestle up during the regular season and hopefully we can get the by-laws amended to solve the qualifier and state issue.
It's great to see these kids that play football, my son wrestles only to play football better . If it wasn't 4 BLT my son would not even have wrested this year and if it wasn't 4 him getting his hinny kicked by bigger kids that was 25+ lbs he would not have worked really hard to lose 15lbs. I feel the pain of not haveing enough weight classes and if we can pressure on the board it might not change for my son but who knows. (maybe)
Here is what I do know. I'm sitting at home with a first place finisher of USJOC and Tulsa Nationals in the 10U HWT Div. We haven't been able to get him into his own age group in KS this year as of yet and come state time he will not be able to participate in his own state's tournament due to him not being able to lose 25lbs. Granted he's a man among boys in his age group, but that doesn't mean him or anyone else should have to wrestle up an age group. The rules are busted the kids aren't
Do not forget he was the Outstanding Wrestler for 10U.
Wow
Theres no room in Kansas for wrestlers like that!!!
WHATEVER!
lISTEN,
I'm done complaining about this.
I want someone from the State Body to get on here and tell us what they are going to do about this issue OR I want them to get on here and hear them openly give their Official Stance as to why these kids will not be given an equal opportunity to wrestle even though they feel its ok to collect their money for their USA wrestling card.
dean 70 I am from D4 and this weekend we had a tournament that combined 10 and under 130, 150, 170, and hwt. Kid that took 2nd busted his rump but was weighing 133 and lost to a kid that weighed 180
I talked to a state rep today. he informed me that we are all on the same page with this. what we have to do is get 2reps from each district to agree on the change. i asked him what was the solution? we agreed that adding an unlimited weight class was ok. i feel pretty strongly on this ammendment. 6 and under, unlimited weight class, 8 and under unlimited weight class, 10 and under unlimited weight class, 12 and under unlimited weight class, 14 and under unlimited, etc.... that should fix the controversey. BLT, we are gonna get this done. period. i will keep complaining.
Charlie
Who did you talk too. What is their name so we can start making a ckeck list.
Are they going to make a propsal at the next meeting. What is the wording of that proposal.
n7m13c99 do you know the reps from your district. Can you talk to them and see if the would be on board.
Anyone from D1 or D4 support this type of change and are willing to get face to face with their reps and ask for support and report back here.
We have got to get organized and move on this or it will get passed by and forgotten until another meeting comes around.
Invitational tourneys are allowed to add an upper class but it cannot happen at the qualifying events. There is some discussion going around about how we can do this when our by-laws have set exact weight classes for each age group. I am going to our mid-term exec board meeting this sunday and should have more to tell you when I get back.
BLT we have been talking to them. Hopefully we will know something on Monday.
Blt what i was told was we need votes at state meeting from all 4 districts. and what district 2 wants theres always this guy in district 1 who gets in the way. where is ditrict 1 anyway?
and why doesnt the freestyle director dont get involved? i don,t know?
dean 70 D1 is basically the eastern 3 counties from nebraska to oaklahoma. From Brown county down to cherokee county.
and what district 2 wants theres always this guy in district 1 who gets in the way.
What is it that district 2 wants?
we want state in Wichita. and we want changes to the weight limits.
Of course District 2 wanted to have state in Wichita. I think even the "guy in District 1"would not have minded having State in Wichita. The problem is Wichita did not want to have State in Wichita.
At the District 2 meeting, not one club representative brought up changing the weight limits.
Make sure you are saying what District 2 wants, and not what you want. There are proper channels for making changes, several were made this year. Complaining on this talk forum does not get change. Submitting changes for the board to discuss does.
Well said Beeson! I attended my first state meeting and had voting rights for my first time. It was very enlightening to see how stuff actually gets done. I saw club directors stand up and explain their proposals in a straight forward yet professional manner. Like I've learned from my local newspapers bloggers, you don't get much done complaining or trying to call people out on a forum (especially if your anonymous), but you have to think of a positive way to present your idea to the right channels so it can get done. It sounds like you guys are passionate for the change you want, so keep the path. There are always more who feel the same way you do but just aren't vocal about it. Words typed on a forum are one thing, but standing up and giving your name in a state meeting and explaining your dilemma are another thing. Good luck and I hope the best for you.
Chad or someone else...
Walk me through the process of getting something infront of the board to be voted on.
Some people may not fully understand the process. Maybe there needs to be a little tab to the left here that helps people to understand it better.
dean 70 D1 is basically the eastern 3 counties from nebraska to oaklahoma. From Brown county down to cherokee county.
Actually there are about 23 counties in Distict 1 from MO/OK/NE borders. This would include KC & suburbs & Topeka. What 3 counties are the "exclusive counties" in District 1 is my question. There have been and will continue to be studs from more than just "3 counties" in District 1. Cherokee Co. happens to have a wrestler on the Nebraska roster and this is D I wrestling we're talking about.
Chad or someone else...
Some people may not fully understand the process.
And that's the way it should be! If you want to understand the process you start by talking to your club director. Then you ask your club director if it would be alright to attend a district meeting in October with them. Once you do that, you ask your club director if you can attend a state meeting with them. Changes start at the club level with your director/directors. As Beeson said, the changes happen as a result of these meetings, not from things said on this message board.
dean 70 D1 is basically the eastern 3 counties from nebraska to oaklahoma. From Brown county down to cherokee county.
Actually there are about 23 counties in Distict 1 from MO/OK/NE borders. This would include KC & suburbs & Topeka. What 3 counties are the "exclusive counties" in District 1 is my question. There have been and will continue to be studs from more than just "3 counties" in District 1. Cherokee Co. happens to have a wrestler on the Nebraska roster and this is D I wrestling we're talking about.
In it to Win it,
I actually think they were saying that from the Missouri line, go west 3 counties, and straight down from Nebraska to Oklahoma. I don't think n7m13c99 was trying to slight any of the other counties.
[quote=BLT] the changes happen as a result of these meetings, not from things said on this message board.
yet YOU have 1,745 posts. do you really BELIEVE that the message boards are a useless tool for stating your case?
i think BLT ASKED a pretty straight forward question as to how to go about changing the rules, yet recieve a couple of roundabout, beat around the bush, condescending answers, that barely answered the question.
THANK YOU SPORTSFAN, your answer was very informative and may have enlighted someone who has never had the opportunity to attend a state meeting, or be involved in anything similar. YET i still don't understand why you feel that the forums are NOT the place to discuss anything (1,745 posts, your opinion has been stated) . BLT, HOSSUS,DEAN70 AND OTHERS may feel that this is the best place to enlighted others of their dilema. where's the harm? they may or may not be the only folks in the state, but using this forum can be used to recruit others to join their fight. now if they FAIL to make a formal proposal at the district level (at very least), then complain again, i see a problem. until then, let them speak.
yet YOU have 1,745 posts. do you really BELIEVE that the message boards are a useless tool for stating your case?
I never said that! It is a wonderful place for discussions but at the same time it is not, nor has it ever been, representative of how even a slight number of people feel. Every week something happens to remind me just how little this board is read by those involved in this sport. Doesn't mean we can't have fun cussing and discussing but in the end the real decisions will be made by those willing to take time out their personal lives to attend the meetings. For all the talk about the weight issue on here, I am told nobody showed up to address the executive council about it. And that is exactly as it should be! First sell your district meeting on any changes and then if successful try to sell it to the state body.
i think BLT ASKED a pretty straight forward question as to how to go about changing the rules, yet recieve a couple of roundabout, beat around the bush, condescending answers, that barely answered the question.
I think I answered in a straight forward manner! Because people don't like mine or others answers they try to circumvent the process to get things changed. I said from the beginning I intend to introduce an amendment to allow wrestlers to wrestle up one age group for qualifiers and state, which should alleviate the weight issue. If it is the intention of some on this board to try to go backwards to unlimited weight groups I would fight that tooth and nail. I as well as others on this board worked long and hard to get the weight classes we currently have in order to keep kids from walking thru state for a medal. I might add, some of those were my own club's kids too who were walking thru. Bottomline was and is, it is what is best for the obese kids, this organization and wrestling as a whole.
BLT, HOSSUS,DEAN70 AND OTHERS may feel that this is the best place to enlighted others of their dilema. where's the harm? they may or may not be the only folks in the state, but using this forum can be used to recruit others to join their fight. now if they FAIL to make a formal proposal at the district level (at very least), then complain again, i see a problem. until then, let them speak.
Sometimes I get the sense that many of the people who ask these questions do not belong to a club. Do they have their own private clubs? If so, that is sad. Do they not have more experienced leaders or members to explain how the processes work? I know that people like Beeson and myself along with many others have had the good fortune to be mentored by those above us at the club level. People with many years of experience at the district and state levels. I would like to think that we are the general rule and not something of privilege in the way our clubs function.
Chad or someone else...
Walk me through the process of getting something infront of the board to be voted on.
Some people may not fully understand the process. Maybe there needs to be a little tab to the left here that helps people to understand it better.
Lance,
Proposals need to be submitted in writing to Ned Price by July 31st. The Executive Council will then meet in September and discuss the proposal. I would suggest attending this meeting to answer any question the council may have. The council will then vote on wether to take it to the State Body for a vote. If it is taken to the State Body it will need to pass, I believe with a 2/3 majority.
I would suggest using this forum as a tool for getting ideas, and feeling people out.
Hey In it to win it dean 70 was asking where D1 was I was trying to explain it and if you look on the map it is the 3 eastern counties. I could have explained it a little better. guess I knew what i was trying to explain. i keeping forgetting that I tend to confuse people including myself. Wasnt talking bad or slighting anyone Just trying to give some info. If I was to describe D4 it would be from great bend west. Which isn't excately right. But darn it I know what I meanLOL to bad no one else does. LOl
I knew what you were trying to say....is that good or bad?
By the way sportsfan02, Robert could have wrestled up/walked to last year and got a medal. thats not what i am looking for. it is just so hard for these kids to find mat time. every moment counts. then they move on to baseball for spring and football for fall. and next year he has no opprotunity for the final show in march. why? because he is a big kid. obese as you say. His size and growth is different than yours and mine. While you have a bottom weight, 40 lbs @ 10 and under, you have a top weight. at what? do you ever know? right now there are 8 kids in the 170 bracket. thats more than 2 or 3 kids that you talked about last year. I am Charles King with the Wichita Aztecas. so i am not posting secret. and i am not hiding.LOL
oh and another thing sportfan02, the maturity difference between age groups is so not right. so how can you expect a 170 10 and under to rate against a 12 @under 165. WOW. are you crazy, or am I novice here?
I am a member of a club.
I am a board member of a club
I have a coach’s card.
I am a bronze level coach.
My sons have their USA wrestling cards.
So if I want to make a proposal or go to a state body meeting I shouldn’t have to go through my club. Who knows maybe they don't feel the way I do and do not support my views. So I shouldn’t need their permission! If I want to go there on my own behalf then I feel I have paid my dues and I have a right to do that.
FYI...
My own children are not victim to this issue. But some of the kids that I have coached are. I have kids that have quit wrestling because they do not get mat time or cannot go to state. No matter how you paint the picture, something not right and change needs to be discussed.
Also, I know what the process is for sending a something before the state committee. I was basically asking on behalf of other that have not stepped up and asked why or how. I don’t know why they haven’t but I asked more on their behalf then my own.
Wrestling up in age is not the fix it all answer to this issue. I used to think it was a good start but now I think it really resolves nothing at all. There is an answer to this and it’s if there is a large enough group of wrestler at ANY weight then that weight should be recognized by our state body.
We make exceptions at the lower weights...
How many kids last year at state were true 8 under kids????
1st of all it wasn’t a full bracket!
2nd there was AT LEAST 7 kids that were 6U that year! SO LESS THEN HALF WERE TRUE 8U Kids!
3rd the kid that won it was a 6U wrestler!
There were more kids over all and more TRUE 8U wrestlers at heavy weight then at 40.
So couldn’t we argue that we could drop or combined some of the lower weights and make room for a few heavier weight classes.
Also,
I hate to speak for Dean70 but to answer Sportsfans question...
NO! There is no one in their club they can turn to with the experience that they find on this forum. They are a young club with a young group of coaches and board members that joined together to save a club in trouble.
So I say that someone with all your "experience and mentoring" should be able to step up and help people like this.
If you feel people like this are below you or a burden to you then stop posting on their thread. Sometimes you just slow the process down or take away from the actual message of THEIR POST because you want to say stuff and cause arguments.
If you are not going to help us the at least stay out of the way and don’t hinder us!
PLEASE!
I can't help you because I do not believe as you do, that we should create weight groups for every child. We have already been there and done that, and corrected the problems it created, many years ago.
ok sportsfan how about this to make room for them let's move the lower weights so that instead of a 3 pound difference They have to wrestle a 10 to 20 pound difference ever week. So lets do 10 and under lets start at 52 the the next weight can be 62 then 72 82 92 102 112 122 132 142 152 162 172 182 That covers about every kid and makes room for the big boys. So are you willing to go with something like this or cause your kid might have to give up say 10 to 12 pounds you ain't for it???? Becareful how you answer this cause sometimes you ain't real tactful.
Two wrongs don't make a right! We studied the lower weights too and eliminated some as well. If anything, we should have possibly eliminated another lower weight or two in each age group. By the way, I'm also for changing 14U to middle school weights and the new High School division to our regular high school weights. No matter how you guys present the question I will be against kids walking thru state for a medal, simple as that.
We studied the lower weights too and eliminated some as well. If anything, we should have possibly eliminated another lower weight or two in each age group.
Looks like you should of studied harder cause you failed the test.
No matter how you guys present the question I will be against kids walking thru state for a medal, simple as that.
So then come out and say that you would rather see brackets that are not full and filled with less then HALF of the kids from the correct age group at state.
I don't want to see anyone walk through to a state title either. I seen how hard my son worked for his.
But if there is a large enough group of kids at any certain weight group within allowance then shouldn't they have the opportunity to wrestle.
And do you think that if there is no opportunity for a chance at state then USAW should step up and not even sell them a card. There's an example of two wrongs right there that everyone seems to think is RIGHT.
But if there is a large enough group of kids at any certain weight group within allowance then shouldn't they have the opportunity to wrestle.
That IS the whole point right there and what the studies proved, there were NOT enough kids in some weight groups! We're not talking about a full bracket, we are talking about enough kids in a bracket to keep a kid from just showing up and collecting his medal.
Our club has an 8U kid who weighs 150#. He has some baby fat but is not obese by any measure. He stands I would guess about 5'5" and wears a size eight and a half mens shoe. This kid wrestles up in age every year just to have an opportunity to wrestle. Neither he nor his parents whine and complain about having to wrestle older kids, like some on this board, because like I said, he just wants to wrestle. All I as a board member of his club want, is for him to have the opportunity to wrestle up in age at the qualifiers. I do not want nor expect us to create a weight group just for him to walk all the way to state.
I my self would rather see a kid walk all the way to state .Than take the kids cash and not let him go at all.I say treat them like the rest of the kids or dont let them play at all.
Just what difrance is it if they do get a walk to state.
My son dose not fit in this group at all.I just cant see how it is A good way to teach the kids at that age or any age.There is some + and some - for the people that are not normal size. I think it would be better for this to be a good thing in this case than a bad.
I think I answered in a straight forward manner! Because people don't like mine or others answers they try to circumvent the process to get things changed. I said from the beginning I intend to introduce an amendment to allow wrestlers to wrestle up one age group for qualifiers and state, which should alleviate the weight issue.
FINALLY you answered in a straight forward manner.
IT'S not that they don't like the answers that you give, it's because it takes 4 pages and 10 posts (from you) to get a reason as to WHY you believe the way you do.
you DID NOT say from the beginning that you intend to introduce an amendment to allow wrestlers to wrestle up one age group, you simply stated WRESTLE UP AN AGE GROUP. it wasn't until your second or third post, that you let anyone know you intentions. then it takes two posts like "what is it d2 wants", it's 4 pages of discussions on weight rules, i wonder. "how are my intentions going to affect anyone or anything. i'm not sure what more anyone wants or needs?" AGAIN, who are you the riddler? i feel that the folks who are trying to change this rule have been straight forward, and deserve to be treated the same.
we get 4 pages and 10 posts before you actually share an experience that might help these YOUNGER/ LESS EXPERIENCE parents/ coaches understand the rules as they stand.
i ask you: WHY DON'T YOU JUST SAY WHAT YOU MEAN THE FIRST TIME.
FOR THE RECORD: i agree with you! i hate to see a kid walk to state and get a plaque. i also believe the BEST solution is to bump up an age group. is it the solution that makes everyone happy, NO, but i believe it's the best possible solution there is.
PARENTS/ COACHES i have coached 2 undefeated 8u HWT STATE CHAMPS, 4 8U HWT STATE PLACERS. EVERYONE OF THEM had to wrestle up in age when they were 8 and when they were 10. ALL BUT 1 PLACED WHEN THEY WERE 10U. ALL BUT 2 of those kids stuck with wrestling through high school, all but 2 of them were offered football scholarships (1 attended a high school without wrestling/ 1 is 10u now). EVERY SINGLE ONE OF THOSE KIDS HAS MADE THIS COMMENT TO ME: " i remember when you made me wrestle up in age, i hated you then, now i'm glad you made me do it, it made me stronger, and better, thanks coach!"
i wasn't easy for them then, by doing what i asked, they have learned to handle life. when things aren't always easy. i have told them many times that i am proud of who they are and what they have become, better young men.
teach your kids to set goals and to push themselves, don't let the fear of losing, guide them. make them challenge themselves, make them better. that is what i love about this sport.
you DID NOT say from the beginning that you intend to introduce an amendment to allow wrestlers to wrestle up one age group, you simply stated WRESTLE UP AN AGE GROUP. it wasn't until your second or third post, that you let anyone know you intentions. then it takes two posts like "what is it d2 wants", it's 4 pages of discussions on weight rules, i wonder. "how are my intentions going to affect anyone or anything. i'm not sure what more anyone wants or needs?" AGAIN, who are you the riddler? i feel that the folks who are trying to change this rule have been straight forward, and deserve to be treated the same.
I'm sorry you are unable to understand my positions on this subject but I think I have been very clear from the beginning. The weight classes as they stand are just fine IMO. If you or others don't like them and want a kid to wrestle then move them up an age group. Please spare me the lessons on proper posting and how to communicate with others.
I instead think it is the others who you are not understanding. They are wanting to create a weight group for every obese kid. I am against that! What more needs to be said?
you DID NOT say from the beginning that you intend to introduce an amendment to allow wrestlers to wrestle up one age group, you simply stated WRESTLE UP AN AGE GROUP. it wasn't until your second or third post, that you let anyone know you intentions. then it takes two posts like "what is it d2 wants", it's 4 pages of discussions on weight rules, i wonder. "how are my intentions going to affect anyone or anything. i'm not sure what more anyone wants or needs?" AGAIN, who are you the riddler? i feel that the folks who are trying to change this rule have been straight forward, and deserve to be treated the same.
I'm sorry you are unable to understand my positions on this subject but I think I have been very clear from the beginning. The weight classes as they stand are just fine IMO. If you or others don't like them and want a kid to wrestle then move them up an age group. Please spare me the lessons on proper posting and how to communicate with others.
I instead think it is the others who you are not understanding. They are wanting to create a weight group for every obese kid. I am against that! What more needs to be said?
i understood your stance just fine, read on in my post I AGREE WITH YOU.
IF OTHER DON'T AGREE THEY ARE FREE TO POST, you have 11 times stated your point, (however failed to give any reason WHY until the last 3) i'll spare you the lessons when you follow the golden rule. don't try to take away someone's right to speak their mind, and i won't critize the manner in which you speak yours.
NOTHING MORE NEEDS TO BE SAID- YOU JUST SHOULD HAVE SAID THAT IN THE FIRST PLACE. if you want to be taken seriously EVERYTIME you oppose someone else's point of view, then be CLEAR from the beginning, as to WHY you oppose. SORRY, that you don't understand that, I AGREE WITH YOU!!! on the weight rules. I DISAGREE WITH YOUR MESSAGE DELIVERY. SORRY I'M NOT THE FIRST AND WON'T BE THE LAST, SORRY YOU CAN'T UNDERSTAND THAT!!!
don't try to take away someone's right to speak their mind,
Show me one place where I did that!
What more needs to be said?
Your name and club affiliation!
What more needs to be said?
Your name and club affiliation!
and what would yours be Aletheia?
And that's the way it should be! If you want to understand the process you start by talking to your club director. Then you ask your club director if it would be alright to attend a district meeting in October with them. Once you do that, you ask your club director if you can attend a state meeting with them. Changes start at the club level with your director/directors. As Beeson said, the changes happen as a result of these meetings, not from things said on this message board.
YOU'RE SOOOOO MISUNDERSTOOD. don't go to the boards and complain, go to the meetings that's where things get done, your message is loud and clear.
i realize that you have put in the time, and have been to the meetings, and have worked to change/ not change rules that you agree/ disagree with. DID YOU DO IT ALONE? no you had supporters. where did they come from? how did you sell your point of view? surely there was some sort of communication.
CHANGES START AS A SMALL IDEA AND GROW- through communication. if they want the rule changed they should follow protocol as you have stated. BUT who are you, i, or beeson, to dictate what channels they take to spread/ grow their idea? if they use the forums to reach out to others who may have the same concerns, that is their right as americans.
i'm sorry once again for MISUNDERSTANDING your point of view, from the beginning, thank you for sharing.
i'm sorry, too for the fact that as some of us welcome an opposing point of view,yet others cannot accept the fact people have a right to their own opinion, NO MATTER HOW/WHEN THEY SHARE IT.
Have a great day! i know i am.
YOU'RE SOOOOO MISUNDERSTOOD. don't go to the boards and complain, go to the meetings that's where things get done, your message is loud and clear.
Thank you for pointing out that I never tried to silence anyone!
The problem i have with you sportsfan is in your post you said you don't want to make a weight group for every obese kid out there. Where do you get that these kids are obese. Some of them are BIG KIDS not obese. We have a 10 and under who stands 5ft 6in and weighs 134 now he was weighing 150 he is not obese. Please don't assume these kids are all obese. some may be but others are not. When your dad is 6ft 5in and weighs 250 and you get his genes you are going to be big not obese. Also answer me this why is it ok for the smaller weights to move up by 3 pounds but the big boys have to move up by 10 or 20 pounds? You realize that if you are in 10 and under and weigh 134 you have to wrestle 150. Because there is not many big boys at this weight you get combined with 170 every week and on paper it looks like you are with in the weigh rules on paper but in reality you are wrestling a kid who weighs 169. So you are giving up 35 pounds. Who in their right mind thinks that doesn't mess with a kids head. Wrestling is not just physical it is mental also and when your kids looks at that big kid he beats himself before he even gets on the mat. Why is this ok? This would be like a 70 pounder wrestling someone that weigh 105 pounds.
Also answer me this why is it ok for the smaller weights to move up by 3 pounds but the big boys have to move up by 10 or 20 pounds?
Because there are more of them!
sportsfan likes to stay on the other side of the fence. no matter what fence.
then he throws little rocks at you and tells you to stay on your side, but his side is better.
when you throw rocks back, he gets upset and tells you not to throw rocks.
then denies ever throwing rocks in the first place.
he really wants to be friends, but he is just misunderstood.
The type of person who understands no one else plight because it doesn't affect you. Then when it does affect you, you expect everyone else to stand up for you and understand. Thus being one of them. And to think i actually defend you on here in another post. It should be about the kids not a few but all of them short, tall, big or little.
enough is enough people. what we need to do on here is discuss the ideas for change. whether kids wrestle up an age group or add weight divisions. headup, you made a good point about wrestling up in age. i thought about that all day. and you are right in a way but from my experience(i was forced to do that twice) it was like comparing hamburger to steak if you understand what i am saying. there was such a great level of maturity between the bottom of 10 and under and the top of 12 and under. sportsfan02, i dont know if you just like to aggravate people on here or you just feel strongly about your view, but the obese comments wasn,t fair to these kids. alot of parents know their kids have an obesity issue. my son is obese . that is why we are wrestling. and after 3 years of trying to figure out what is going on with his weight gain issue, we just found out that he has thyroid problems. we have listened to all the advice about the diet. and we still found him gaining 10 to 20 lbs a year. there are other kids i see that are just tall and muscular at this age. what i want from you is your ideas, not critical attitude. for two years all you can say is no kid should get to walk to state. it happens every year whether you like it or not. i asked for my kid to be able to wrestle up last year in the qualifiers. they have to wrestle their own age group. thats what the rule is right now. the other thing you keep saying is that the weghts have been studied to death and no change is needed. please dont reply to my post unless you want to be part of the solution. thank you very much
we're going to hurt feelings if we don't back off.
sportsfan likes aggravating people/ and believes very strongly about some issues, and believes very strongly that there is only one right way, his way.
we ALL just misunderstand.
DEAN70- hamburger to steak, good analogy, but don't be afraid to crave that steak, it should be a driving force.
dean70 i agree with your thoughts on moving up we had a kid wrestle up to 12 and under. He is a young 10 and under 150 wanted to wrestle closer to his own weight. So chose to wrestle up at 140. He is a pretty good wrestler. He got thumped pretty bad. Those boys just had a maturity about them that he didn't have. At Great Bend seen a 8 and under move up to 10 and under it wasn't pretty. So am not sure that is the answer. Can we look at other states and see what their weight classes are. See if someone somewhere else does something different. Not talking just Oklahoma but look further east or west see what they do to get some ideas? Is there a reason we limit ourselves to the weigth classes we have?
Why can't the weight classes change from year to year?
This is just an off the cuff thought, but what if every club sent a spreadsheet into the State around the middle of the year with their wrestlers names, age groups, and weights. They then could determine if there were enough bigger wrestlers to justify adding a weight class. Copy and paste all the info into one spreadsheet, sort it by age and weight, and waaaallllaa! 99% of the weight classes would remain the same, but we might find out that we have some holes in some age groups from time to time.
Just a thought !!
n7m and Pelland, these are both great ideas. The spreadsheet would be a great tool. but who is going to check it out? maybe sportsfan02 has the time? Oh, he/she already has maybe 5 or 10 years ago. good idea, I will get with the kids regtistration director on that. And yes we should look at other states to see what they are doing. That is how we get stronger. See what is working For Iowa and Arizona wrestling. Or find states with more HWTs and see what they are doing. Wrestling Trains for Football. More kids gets football scholarships than Wrestling scholarships. So why not welcome the big kids?
n7m, so you are drom district4? I need you to get with your District 4 state rep and have him call me. Lethim look et the thread and give us his input.thanks
The type of person who understands no one else plight because it doesn't affect you. Then when it does affect you, you expect everyone else to stand up for you and understand. Thus being one of them. And to think i actually defend you on here in another post. It should be about the kids not a few but all of them short, tall, big or little.
I think if you will go back and read my posts I said our club does have a kid who is too large to wrestle in his own age group for qualifiers. I am attempting to remedy that. So I'm not one of "them", instead I'm one of "those".
enough is enough people. what we need to do on here is discuss the ideas for change. whether kids wrestle up an age group or add weight divisions. headup, you made a good point about wrestling up in age. i thought about that all day. and you are right in a way but from my experience(i was forced to do that twice) it was like comparing hamburger to steak if you understand what i am saying. there was such a great level of maturity between the bottom of 10 and under and the top of 12 and under. sportsfan02, i dont know if you just like to aggravate people on here or you just feel strongly about your view, but the obese comments wasn,t fair to these kids. alot of parents know their kids have an obesity issue. my son is obese . that is why we are wrestling. and after 3 years of trying to figure out what is going on with his weight gain issue, we just found out that he has thyroid problems. we have listened to all the advice about the diet. and we still found him gaining 10 to 20 lbs a year. there are other kids i see that are just tall and muscular at this age. what i want from you is your ideas, not critical attitude. for two years all you can say is no kid should get to walk to state. it happens every year whether you like it or not. i asked for my kid to be able to wrestle up last year in the qualifiers. they have to wrestle their own age group. thats what the rule is right now. the other thing you keep saying is that the weghts have been studied to death and no change is needed. please dont reply to my post unless you want to be part of the solution. thank you very much
I feel for your problem but tell me how creating a weight bracket just for your child to walk to state will solve his/your problems. I gave you my solution to the problem yet you don't want to hear that. I have witnessed heavyweights in high school who spent the better part of two years getting down to weight so they could wrestle. They didn't ask for a special weight group and that will not be available for your son as well. IMO you and others are only encouraging the obesity by attempting to create weight groups where they can walk to a medal at state.
I gave you my solution to the problem yet you don't want to hear that. IMO you and others are only encouraging the obesity by attempting to create weight groups where they can walk to a medal at state.
NO, they didn't AGREE with your solutions, BUT stated clearly WHY they don't AGREE.
NOW i have seen 4-5 people who DISAGREE with you AND I, it's OK, they have made their case, as have you, we will see how it pans out come state meeting time.
accusing parents and coaches of encouraging obesity? are you serious? which is your stance, NO WALKS TO STATE, or NO OBESE KIDS IN WRESTLING?
i'm on board with the first, but have a major problem with discriminatory comments like this, just because these people don't agree with YOU, doesn't mean you have to cross lines. your true colors are beginning to show.
FYI- just like the state meetings, there is protocol that should be followed before you make such statements. it has something to do with walking a mile in their shoes. I DON'T KNOW ANY OF THESE PEOPLE, BUT CAN PROMISE YOU, THEY ARE NOT TRYING TO ENCOURAGE OBESITY.
PELLAND'S IDEA WOULD BE A LITTLE MORE WORK EACH YEAR, BUT I SOUNDS LIKE THE "BEST OF BOTH WORLDS".
dean70 yes i am from D4 I will get ahold of Woody and give him your info.
There is some very good thoughts in here.I hope the state put some of them to use.
Like stated befor if they pay they should get to play.
It is not just my son i am representing on here. i can see this happening again in the 8 and under down the road to kids that are not even wrestling yet. maybe you headup and sportsfan02 are correct. wrestling up might not give a kid a sense of accomplishment today. and they won,t appreciate it until years down the road. I will agree to that part. I took a look at the results from 2009. Not everybody would be happy with a proposal for kids to wrestle up. I would be ok with that compromise. How would you decide who is elgible to wrestle up??? Next thing you know, the kids wouldn,t be working as hard to get to state. I dont know all the answers. that is why I have got on this forum. This is the tool for all of us to communicate what is right for the sport and the kids. So I would like to see more input. I also see that studying the brackets can be overwhelming. But it would be worth it if these kids have the opprotunity to wrestle for the finale every year instead of seeing that the can play but not in the playoffs. they are defeated before they get started. sportsfan02, what exactly would be in your proposal?
I have been dealing with this problem fora while now. MY son is 10U 150, at almost every tournament we have been to he has had to wrestle in the HWT bracket or had HWT's inserted in his bracket. When your weighing in at 1488-49 and your opponent is weighing 170+ that is not fair to him. HE can't move these kids. Those 20+ pounds do make a difference. Today they combined his bracket with the HWT's and there were 2 kids in his bracket him and another kid. Needless to say the HWT's took first and second place while he came in 3rd. He got his bell rung by the one kid when the kid fell on his head. Is ther eanything we can do about his?
yes big DeBo talk to dean70 he is working on getting a list of kids that are in the HWT classes to take to the state and district reps that will increase weight classes or letting them move up in age. Send him a message. One of the kids in our club is sent in at 150 because in 10 and under it goes from 130 to 150 he is weighting 135 and is being combined with 170 and hwt which means that he is giving up at least 30 pounds or more. We always tell him before he goes out just don't get underneath him. We practice leg sweeps with him so he does shoot in cause that would get ugly.
so sportsfan02, what was that proposal suppose to look like?
I will submit my proposal to the executive board before the deadline. Right now I'm busy following the high school guys. I will not post my proposal on here either before or after, so if you want to see or hear it, you will need to attend the state meeting.
Give me a break. If you have one let us know what it is. Maybe we could help you. I am not sure you even have one. Just blowing smoke.
I think I basically layed out the gist of it in my earlier post on this thread. Not sure what more there is to explain. I never blow smoke where our constitution is concerned.
yeah it's laid out somewhere around pg. 2 or 3.
more like smoke and mirrors, just like all great politicians.LOL, it took some digging, but it's there........and i happen to agree with it!
Yeah it's such a hard change to grasp after reading that post.