Kansas Wrestling
Posted By: -BAG- State 2006 - 02/03/05 03:44 PM
What do you think about 4A state being in Salina rather than Wichita next year?
Posted By: RJW Re: State 2006 - 02/03/05 04:05 PM
LOVE IT!!! Can't wait. It has been a long time coming.
Posted By: TCarmona Re: State 2006 - 02/03/05 07:30 PM
I am not for it. I really like that 6a, 5a and 4a have been together. Wrestling for diffrent kids programs and summer wrestling camps you see kids from diffrent classes. As a person who used to wrestle and still a big fan I think it is better to keep the 3 together. I used to see if I could see any of the 321a results on TV. I know it is more of a convience for some, but kills that feeling of how state has been over many years.
Posted By: TCarmona Re: State 2006 - 02/03/05 07:35 PM
Some schools move up and down in classifcations. I would of not liked if my school wrestled 4a moved to salina and I didn't get to see a Dusy Spalding 6a back in the day, Bo Maynes 5a from salina. I mean It sounds nice and Dandy for making it closer for some but kills other big matches you might like to see. I think it was a bad idea to split them up.
Posted By: MAS Re: State 2006 - 02/03/05 07:50 PM
"I don't get to see all the matches" that is all anyone has as an argument. I think it is a great move. Number 1, four mats we start later and get done earlier. Number 2, better facility, Number 3, Better staff maybe the athletes will be treated like they are important rather than like the are an inconvenience. As a Coach it is important that the move benefits the wrestlers involved. In my opinion it does, there for it is a great move. I can live with missing matches and having our teams be better rested and more prepared.
Posted By: SCWRESTLINGFAN Re: State 2006 - 02/04/05 02:16 AM
I think it will be great. Not just because it's closer to home, but because it breaks up the crowd a little bit. Sometimes Wichita just gets too busy for my liking. Some people like the big crowds but not everyone.
Posted By: TCarmona Re: State 2006 - 02/23/05 04:24 PM
MAS why don't you just say cause it is an hour and a half closer. You may be a coach but not a fan. And many coaches also like to point out qualites of other wrestlers while watching big time matches. Kind of a learning tool.
Posted By: Scooby Re: State 2006 - 02/23/05 04:30 PM
I have been thinking on this over the past couple weeks and I would like to see all the state held under one roof because I enjoy watching all the finals. many times you have seen these kids grow up and wrestler against your kids in fed but then in high School you lose track of them. besides it would be easier for scouts to watch at one place and not have to drive to 3 places to watch the state competition
Posted By: Mike Church Sr. Re: State 2006 - 02/23/05 05:01 PM
I have a better ideal for 4A, let them have their regionals leave all the wrestlers at home, send the coaches to Salina and draw straws for champions and ect. Look at all the travle money they could save plus you wouldn't have to watch anyone wrestle. :-)
Posted By: A. Oncewas Re: State 2006 - 02/23/05 05:07 PM
I've wrestled in the 3,2,1A finals in Hays and been to the 4,5,6A in Wichita. The biggest difference comes in the finals. The fan excitement level is much higher when there is only one championship match to watch at a time. The last time I was in Wichita the only thing that brought pretty much everyone's attention to one mat was Bo Maynes going for his fourth. Just my opinion.
Posted By: MATT-FAN Re: State 2006 - 02/23/05 08:25 PM
i have a better idea for mike how about you guys come out to goodland and colby each year for state it's easy to make those comments when everything is right there in your own lap.
Posted By: Nigel Isom Re: State 2006 - 02/23/05 09:06 PM
Personally I kind of like the idea of having State in Salina, granted its nice to be able to see the other finals in wichita, but thats not really what I came to watch. I come to watch my alma mater kick some tail and hopefully take home a state championship, not watch watch someone i've never heard of from 5 or 6A beating down some other person I've never heard of. No disrespect to these guys, I just don't really pay attention to the upper classes.
Posted By: TCarmona Re: State 2006 - 02/23/05 09:17 PM
T-COACH/DAD, I wouldn't care if they changed the place every year. It's just that I don't like that fact that they are splitting them up. The thing everyone for out west is crying about is it being to far. I do like how they have 321A on TV college style. I do agree that it is easier to focus on one mat. My point is it is not the same split up. I know that there are always fights on what class is the best, but come state time you will see people from 4A checking out the 6a matches and vise versa. Many kids out in western kansas enjoy coming out to WSU for track. I know it is a diffrent sport but just trying to give you a feel.
Posted By: Aaron Sweazy Re: State 2006 - 02/23/05 09:28 PM
As someone who went through 4a I'm glad it will be closer to home, however, I will miss seeing some of the other talent from the state, but then again, I can see some of them at tournaments throughout the year. I don't want to be reminded of 40 guys on the floor at Wichita that were 8-50 on the career and 4 time state qualifiers.
Posted By: mikechurch Re: State 2006 - 02/23/05 11:13 PM
Sweaz- common now, I agree there are a fair share of bad brackets at the state, but that is b/c the regionals are unfairly matched. Until we coaches decide to change it we will see this! I am however, getting bashed for my recommendation, so I would love to see the thoughts of others. I know the K.C. regionals don't want to break up, they wouldnt be able to take 13 kids anymore and would probably be down to 5-8 like everyone else Of course Sweazy, I was 32-0 going into the State Tourney (6A), what Hell, Zack Roberson was undefeated (6A) and so was Bo Mainus (5A). You would miss the Dusty Spauldings (6A). Sweaz, I hope you have a very good time at the tourney this year. God Bless ya!
Posted By: Ole Timer Re: State 2006 - 02/23/05 11:24 PM
-Nigel you really disappoint me. I thought you knew it all and now when you tell us how dominate one class is over the other you really don't know you are just guessing because you just know the wrestlers from your hometown. I guess I have to find a new know-it-all. I for one will miss having all that talent in one place.

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Personally I kind of like the idea of having State in Salina, granted its nice to be able to see the other finals in wichita, but thats not really what I came to watch. I come to watch my alma mater kick some tail and hopefully take home a state championship, not watch watch someone i've never heard of from 5 or 6A beating down some other person I've never heard of. No disrespect to these guys, I just don't really pay attention to the upper classes.
Posted By: Donald Duck Re: State 2006 - 02/24/05 01:02 AM
i dont really understand the whole ordeal... just go where you need to be and do the best you can... it dont matter the gym... as a wrestler... i have no problem goin somewhere else to wrestle... ya never know... maybe salina has softer mats
Posted By: Nigel Isom Re: State 2006 - 02/24/05 12:17 PM
Wrong ole timer, I never said one class was dominate over another. What I did say is I go to watch my hometown wrestle, since they are 4A, I typically go to watch the 4A wrestlers because I keep up with 4A and I know the wrestlers who are competiting in that class, I don't have any interest in 5A and 6A and therefore the move to Salina doesn't have me in somme big uproar like it does so to some other people. I never watched Dutsy May wrestle and I was there at state. I watched about 2 minutes of Doug Hoover wrestling. I saw Bo Manynes stumble back at state his senior year, I saw the Travis Stites, I saw Zach Roberson. But would I feel any worse off if I had missed that because state was somewhere else? Heck No, I'm sure the people over at 3-2-1A State were doing just fine, and they missed out. Are you telling me its is my obligation to have to like and want to watch the other classes? Let me ask you this, when your hometeam is wrestling somewhere, do you typically go to a different tournament where they are not to watch other teams, or would you prefer to be at a tournament where your hometeam is watching them, and if there are some interesting matches on other mats, you tune in to them. Its not that I just like Abilene, I like all teams in 4A because that is where I come from. I'm proud everytime a 4A team finishes higher than other classes at tournaments. I don't mind watching these high profile finals matches from 5 and 6A at state, but to make an arguement that its not fair to move just so everyone can see the finals of each class is crazy, what about the other 7 rounds?
Posted By: Aaron Sweazy Re: State 2006 - 02/24/05 12:40 PM
Quote:
Its not that I just like Abilene, I like all teams in 4A because that is where I come from.
On a side note, not all 4a schools like him. JK

BTW, is it going to cost $5 for the Hospitality Room this year?
Posted By: Nigel Isom Re: State 2006 - 02/24/05 02:59 PM
Its more like hostility room!
Posted By: RJW Re: State 2006 - 02/24/05 03:21 PM
TCarmona- The coaches at Colby are wrestling fans, but during the State tourney, we are coaches first. We want what is best for our athletes even if that cramps our style as fans. We love to watch wrestling, but getting to see a few 5A or 6A matches is not a big enough positive to overcome all the negatives of the three classes being together.
Whatever your opinion is about 4A State being in Salina without 5A and 6A, the bottom line is that it will be that way for the next two years and hopefully forever!!
We are also big "fans" of college wrestling. We went to a tourney in Dallas this year that was connected to a college event so our kids could see some college wrestling. We, in Colby, are especially big "fans" of our former Colby High School wrestlers in college. That would be our returning D1 National Runner-up, our returning Juco National Chanpion, and our returning Juco All American.
Posted By: Wrestling Scholar Re: State 2006 - 02/24/05 03:22 PM
Salina is an idea. A better idea would be to move the state tournament to Topeka (4-6A). It would be a more central location to the population of the state and arguably has better facilities. I think a large majority of schools would be closer to Topeka than Wichita.

This location would give many Kansas City fans a chance to see the best wrestling in the state and would help build more interest in the Kansas City area. I see no reason why Wichita gets to monopolize the state tourmament every year.
Posted By: RJW Re: State 2006 - 02/24/05 03:30 PM
The best idea is 4A in Salina and 5-6A in Topeka.
Posted By: Gary Ulmer Re: State 2006 - 02/24/05 03:50 PM
My thoughts have always been the only way to improve the state wrestling tournaments at Wichita and Hays would be to combine them.

The Wichita meet has been a wonderful presentation to the fan. Coach Williams, wrestling needs the fan or we will lose the sport itself. I think we are leaving the fan out of our thoughts to "improve" wrestling. Moving 4a to Salina is not going to make anything better for the sport of wrestling or the people who watch it.

Gary Ulmer
Posted By: Nigel Isom Re: State 2006 - 02/24/05 05:39 PM
I like Coach Williams idea,

To think that fans will no longer go to watch the state tourney just because 4A isn't there is crazy. The same people who have watched state before will travel to see state again next year. Anyone selfish enough to not go to a tournament just because three classes aren't there is foolish. And im not entirely sure the Fans, Coaches, or Wrestlers have ever been happy with the way the Wichita Staff and "Security" handles things.
Posted By: Straightshooter Re: State 2006 - 02/24/05 06:42 PM
Been to Hays and Wichita. Hays was better by far. More of a family atmosphere and it DOES make a difference. You're crazy if you don't stop and stare at all the red from Hoxie and all the blue from Norton.
In my opinion 4A will be better off on their own.
Posted By: Ryan Jilka Re: State 2006 - 02/24/05 07:54 PM
4A may be better off on their own, but wrestling will not be. The more we spread the state tournament out, the less publicity it will get. Go to any state tournament (any sport) that is for an entire state, and it is much more exciting and receives much more press. I agree that Hays is an outstanding tournament, and I wish all classes could have that.
Posted By: Cody Schields Re: State 2006 - 02/24/05 08:33 PM
One thing you all need to learn. Nigel is never wrong!
Posted By: mom4 Re: State 2006 - 02/24/05 08:43 PM
Reading all of the post, it seems to me that the people complaining the most are the people from Wichita. I wonder why........
Posted By: Mike Church Sr. Re: State 2006 - 02/24/05 09:15 PM
T-COACH/DAD
Goodland and Colby would be like a walk in the park for me. You get state there and I'll come!!
All I'm saying is if you don't like being in the same building with 5A and 6A then go it alone. No sweat off our a$$. Now if having 4A in Wichita is a geographical nitemare thats one thing but what I am implying is you don't need to be derogatory about 5A and 6A along the way. I have the same opinion as alot of 4A people I usually watch 5A and 6A because thats where 95% of the people I care to watch are. Very seldom do I look down where 4A is wrestling unless someone brings my attention to a good match.I doubt what Colby or Goodland could even put on such event due to lodging,resturaunt,and facility needs!!! I may be wrong.
Good luck at state and may your wishes come true for next year.
Posted By: Nigel Isom Re: State 2006 - 02/24/05 09:36 PM
Cody this isn't about being right and wrong its about personal opinion and I'm of the opinion that I don't really care if 5 and 6A are in the same building as 4 because thats not who I am there to watch. As Mr. Church says, I'll glance down at the other mats if some really good wrestler comes up and nothing is really going on down in 4a, its nothing personal.
Posted By: Cody Schields Re: State 2006 - 02/24/05 09:41 PM
Take it easy Nigel. I'm just messing with ya.
Posted By: Mike Church Sr. Re: State 2006 - 02/24/05 11:20 PM
Now Cody that wasn't very nice calling security at state in Wichita a group of dicks. I have some really good freinds that live here in Wichita from the Hill City area and one of them wanted me to tell you something but I can't print that on here. Family people read all this stuff. You be a good boy and talk nice.
Posted By: pantherwrestler69 Re: State 2006 - 02/27/05 07:10 PM
i think dat they should have 4A in Salina, 5A in Topeka, and 6A in Wichita
Posted By: Hovpen Re: State 2006 - 02/27/05 07:16 PM
Well, with four venues to choose from to photograph, I will not make that choice. How about a nice Shocker baseball game that day? It was so nice being able to have all the best in one location. Forced to choose among four seperate tournaments, I'm just not going to. I'll stay home and go to the KCAC basketball playoffs or a baseball game that day. Call me when I can photograph all three classes in one location again. (I'll still do the regular season tournaments I've been doing, so I'm not giving up on you all together, just disappointed in your leadership in this)I don't see how it can possibly be good for wrestling in Kansas from my viewpoint
Posted By: ksbevo Re: State 2006 - 02/27/05 07:32 PM
You know that the kids look forward to coming to wichita, for other reasons. But splitting them up dilutes the tension. When the Downtown arena is finished it will be a great enviorment for wrestling. Also there will be a decline in gate receipts, that go to putting on a great show.Really think the 4-a schools need to figure what will be lost.
Posted By: beautiful_manager Re: State 2006 - 02/28/05 12:53 AM
4A in Salina will be great because with 6A and 5A being so large, the amount of people in Wichita is amazing. With most of the good 4A schools being closer to Salina than Wichita, more people can then also have the opportunity to come and watch. At Hays, the atmosphere is more friendly and people don't seem as stressed out, simply because the amount of people is less. I believe, granted some schools may have to travel further, the atmosphere will be more like that of Hays, which from experience, is personally a lot better than Wichita. If not the first year because the Bi-Center may not know what to expect, then years to come.
Posted By: TCarmona Re: State 2006 - 03/02/05 06:07 PM
Straightshooter, are you saying that there being more wrestling fans than family is bad? I think having family around is great, but our sport needs fans.

Lemon, I want to know why the Wichita people are complaing so much.
Posted By: RJW Re: State 2006 - 03/02/05 06:24 PM
The media coverage is a poor reason to keep it together. State basketball and football are held at numerous sites and the media figures out a way to cover them because they care. The media overall drops the ball when it comes to wrestling coverage. However, the Hays newspaper does a great job with their 3-2-1A State Tourney Preview and coverage after the tourney. Maybe the Salina Journal can do the same for 4A using Hays as a model.
Posted By: Wrestling Scholar Re: State 2006 - 03/02/05 06:42 PM
I've been to a few other state wrestling tournaments, and nobody I've seen splits classes up to different locations. Here's a question, is Kansas the only state that splits up their state tournament?

There is nothing like getting the whole state wrestling community together to show case their sport. In my opinion, different locations is a step backwards for Kansas. I just went to the Ohio state tournament, and thats a big wrestling party with a lot of electricity. The kids loved wrestling in front of the big crowd which was greater than 15,000 people. Also each class was entertaining with great wrestling thoughout each class. Big school and small school people show up and have a good time.

The kids go to small tournaments all season. To me, the 4A class tournament in Salina is another small tournament. I would be disappointed if I was a 4A wrestler and didn't go to the big party. Less people to show off your skills too.

Kansas needs to think big to support wrestling, not small.

The scholar
Posted By: Aaron Sweazy Re: State 2006 - 03/02/05 06:59 PM
How bare is Wichita going to look with only the 5 and 6a teams there? 5 and 6a schools for the most part are basketball oriented, there are some that break the mold. Also will the venue in Salina be too big for 1 class?
Posted By: TCarmona Re: State 2006 - 03/02/05 07:35 PM
I think CO has all classes at the Pepsi center. Man that would be pretty cool. I helped with working the state trny at FHSU. The thing Salina will be hurting is who is gonna plan and run the big show. Besides the wrestling there are manythings on the side. Fans and parents don't see.
Posted By: P. Pitbull's Old Dog Re: State 2006 - 03/02/05 07:45 PM
I would like to know where all the people were this year, the stands did not seem as crowded as years past,

I like the idea of the big show. I wrestled for a State Championship at Junction City High School way back in 1979. It was an awesome feeling, but after going and watch my nephew wrestling at the state tourney in Wichita, in the mid 90's, I thought it was so much of a bigger thing.

Nothing against Junction City High School or any other high school, I just hope they have the tournament at Venues that are not High Schools so that it does not seem like just another high school tournament.

If we wnat to watch the big name wrestlers from our state wrestle in the same building we need to have a grand state and then we would really find out who the real state champ of Kansas really is anyway. Sometimes we find out from Kids State or Freestyle and Greco but not everybody wrestles kids and FS/GR.

I will miss not having the 3 together as a fan, as a coach, all my wreslters need is a mat and an opponent, where ever I am coaching at, whether we are in Salina or Wichita, or Hays.....

I guess we will just have to see how this all turns out it could be good or bad, I just hope we keep doing what is best for the kids and the sport of wrestling in what ever we do and decide.

Coach Peterman
Posted By: TCarmona Re: State 2006 - 03/02/05 08:24 PM
Well said
Posted By: MES Re: State 2006 - 03/02/05 09:46 PM
Media Coverage loss for 4A going to Salina?

Who has Finals on TV now?

Looks to me like 3A has better coverage now!

I too have been to 4, 5, and 6 A in Wichita, 3A in Hays, and been to Nebraska and Iowa State Tourneys.

Iowa’s is absolutely crazy as you have to get in a lottery to get tickets for the finals, and Nebraska sells out the last day. Both states have their wrestlers all in the same spot.

Both states do a good job of running the state tournament this way. I have never witnessed in NE or IA people trying to get on the floor when they do not belong, security guards that accost people, cold facility, charge for hospitality room, or driving 30-45 minutes for something to eat and a place to stay as I have in Wichita.

I liked Wichita until I went to Hays! If you have never been to Hays for the State Tourney, don’t knock it!

Wrestlers and coaches become accustom to what they are used too. When I came down from Nebraska, I could not believe that all classes were not together but now after being to both state tournaments, I can see why there are not.

Hays does a great job and the fans are very knowledgeable of the sport and supportive of their teams. The 3A state tourney has greater school fan support than Iowa, Nebraska or Wichita! Some teams have the majority of the town watching and cheering.

Maybe when suitable facilities are found, we can talk more about all classes being together, until then, no way.
Posted By: taos46 Re: State 2006 - 03/02/05 10:53 PM
GRAND-STATE WOULD SOLVE A GREAT DEAL OF WONDERING!!!!
Posted By: VS Vike coach Re: State 2006 - 03/02/05 11:24 PM
Well said MES!!

We (Iowa) had our last tournament at old Veterans' Auditorium in Des Moines this year; the finals drew 12,600-plus (out of 21,000 ticket requests; thank God for live TV) and next year we move across the street to the brand-new 15,000-seat Wells Fargo Arena. No more fans right on matside, but otherwise a great move.

After coaching in both Hays and Wichita, it's Hays in a landslide, as in no contest. Ideally, all four classes would be together somewhere in Kansas but facility and political-wise that will never happen. In the meantime (at the sake of offending Mr. Saylers) the Kansas Coliseum is a cesspool. If I were still coaching in 4A in Kansas, I would have thrown a Bastille Day party in honor of leaving that place for Salina.

After attending the State volleyball tournament in Salina for many years, I can tell you that the workers there are both helpful and friendly, the hospitality room was much nicer and FREE and the community was welcoming. 6As and 5As, if you want the place (Wichita) it's all yours, but my best wishes and congratulations to my former 4A berthern on their escape from overpriced food and backed-up toilets to the Xanadu of the Bicentennial Center!!!!
Posted By: Mike Church Sr. Re: State 2006 - 03/02/05 11:35 PM
Aaron Sweazy,
I'm glad you asked the question of how bare will it be for just 5A and 6A because we looked it over this past weekend. This is what we come up with. Not much seating if any will be needed above the ground floor at the Kansas Colliseum, thats nice because now all schools can hang their banner without argument or being crowded. We will have extra matts so we can start maybe an hr later, and getting out earlier will be nice for those who are traveling. The urninals won't be overflowing and more grub in the hostility room will be nice. Ceremonies will be great also all that anouncing drives me nuts,cutting it down by one third is awesome. I'm sure 4A will enjoy their state but I don't think 5A and 6A folks haven't even thought of all the benefits. I can't wait.
Posted By: Wrestling Scholar Re: State 2006 - 03/03/05 01:41 PM
MES is right about Iowa and Nebraska tournaments being well run, entertaining to watch and draw good crowds. Went to both in early 90s. Note, all classes come together for these states and they have good facilities.

In Missouri, all classes come together at the Hearnes Center in Columbia. Another well run tournament that is exciting to watch.

Never been to the tournament in Hayes but did go to the NAIA national wrestling tournamnents when hosted there. They did a good job and Fort Hayes state has a cozy field house.

As I said earlier, Kansas is going backwards by splitting up the tournament. Less for fans to see. Other states do it right. I could see the arugment for Hays having own tourney. It's close to the schools, but moving 4A doesn't make sense.
Posted By: jmadden Re: State 2006 - 03/03/05 01:48 PM
The Hays paper does not do all that much media coverage. It is a disappointment. They basically reprint a lot of prtogram information.
Posted By: VS Vike coach Re: State 2006 - 03/03/05 02:16 PM
And that is the problem with a split tournament TIGER. But, in all honesty, media coverage isn't the point; the point is the comfort and convienence of the athletes, coaches and fans (hence 4As escape from Wichita). The media coverage is just something you have to live with. Kansas has far too deep and long traditions of splitting up state tournaments and that is why move classes to different sites is a viable option.

In Iowa, as in most states, football, basketball, wrestling, track, baseball, softball, etc., all have their own unified site. Des Moines is the site of most of them, but we have the 20,000 domed stadium in Cedar Falls for football and a four-diamond facility in Fort Dodge that hosts softball. In Kansas that has never been a priority, so scattering State events is not at all unusual. Get Salina to build an 18,000-seat arena and you'd have it made!!!
Posted By: Straightshooter Re: State 2006 - 03/03/05 02:56 PM
Carmona
I said a family ATMOSPHERE...take it for what it's worth. Of course with Hoxie and Sainty there probably is lots of family there too!
Posted By: Wrestling Scholar Re: State 2006 - 03/03/05 04:23 PM
To VS Vike coach

We have a 50 year old facility that will hold over 16,000 in Lawrence to host site. Also Topeka's facility is big enough but not sure of capacity.

Topeka might be closer to more schools than Salina.
Posted By: Ryan Jilka Re: State 2006 - 03/03/05 07:14 PM
First of all, who said 5A and 6A like state in Wichita? Do you really think that because we're used to a bigger town, we like what happens there? The thing I like about state in Wichita is that it is crowded, there are 3 classes to see, and it is better for wrestling! I did not say wrestlers, but wrestling.

If you want comfort, Goddard High School could host a 16 man tournament. Won't that be fun. "Guess what guys, because we can put on a better hospitality room and the fans can get home an hour earlier, you get to come to school for State!"

Real fans want the wrestling atmosphere and will put up with some poor accomodations for the sake of good wrestling. I don't blame 4A for wanting a better place, but if you can possibly explain to me how it will help wrestling as a whole, please do. I coach at a 6A school, but I care much more for the sport than my own comfort.

Sometimes I feel that the thing that keeps wrestling from getting the recognition it deserves is not it's complexity, basketball, the media, or title IX, but it is us! We rip on each other for weak regionals. We accuse teams of recruiting. We spend hours debating which class is better. What in the hell would happen if we actually spent the same energy promoting our sport?????
Posted By: VS Vike coach Re: State 2006 - 03/03/05 07:44 PM
Scholar:

Oh yes, I know all about that 50-year old facility in Lawrence, but the feeling I always had when I was down there was that there was a better chance of winning the lottery than there would ever be of getting the landlords of that place to let anyone use if for (dare I say it?) 'RASSLIN'!!!

I actually floated the suggestion a few years back of putting 6A and 5A in Bramlege and 4A and 3-2-1A in Ahern, but you can imagine how far that went....
Posted By: Straightshooter Re: State 2006 - 03/03/05 07:46 PM
Same thing happens in other sports...why do you think they added an extra team to football playoffs a few years back. Baseball has their own state competitions. Football has theirs. Just give it a chance and see what happens.
Posted By: MES Re: State 2006 - 03/03/05 08:31 PM
If you could (would) have all 4 classes together in Kansas, guess what, an extra day of state tourney unless you could find a place that could hold 12 (16 better) mats.

Wichita might be able to do that if they took down the wall and made everybody but wrestlers and coaches stay up in the stands.

What about the new facility being built in Wichita, how big is it going to be?

Mike
Posted By: sportsfan02 Re: State 2006 - 03/03/05 08:57 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by Ryan Jilka:
First of all, who said 5A and 6A like state in Wichita? Do you really think that because we're used to a bigger town, we like what happens there? The thing I like about state in Wichita is that it is crowded, there are 3 classes to see, and it is better for wrestling! I did not say wrestlers, but wrestling.

If you want comfort, Goddard High School could host a 16 man tournament. Won't that be fun. "Guess what guys, because we can put on a better hospitality room and the fans can get home an hour earlier, you get to come to school for State!"

Real fans want the wrestling atmosphere and will put up with some poor accomodations for the sake of good wrestling. I don't blame 4A for wanting a better place, but if you can possibly explain to me how it will help wrestling as a whole, please do. I coach at a 6A school, but I care much more for the sport than my own comfort.

Sometimes I feel that the thing that keeps wrestling from getting the recognition it deserves is not it's complexity, basketball, the media, or title IX, but it is us! We rip on each other for weak regionals. We accuse teams of recruiting. We spend hours debating which class is better. What in the hell would happen if we actually spent the same energy promoting our sport?????
Amen to what Coach Jilka says! But Coach don't blame even a majority of 4A coaches for wanting to split the tournament. As far as I can find out, it's still a small group who want this split.
Posted By: VS Vike coach Re: State 2006 - 03/03/05 10:24 PM
Oh dear! An extra day! Not that!!!!!

Geez we can have four days for basketball; would it kill anyone to give an extra day to wrestling to have a combined tournament? Oh wait, I know the answer to that one....never mind
Posted By: acbulldog Re: State 2006 - 03/03/05 10:28 PM
I think it will be great having 4a cow folk away i know they will miss the agriculture show in whichita but life goes on and can't wait to see the senior classic this year, all the hype of the lower schools going back home with their heads held low.
Posted By: acbulldog Re: State 2006 - 03/03/05 10:30 PM
wichita i mean now i sound like the cow folk lol.
Posted By: VS Vike coach Re: State 2006 - 03/03/05 10:31 PM
Hey, I know I missed the smells of the ag show in Wichita this year....oh wait, that was the backed-up toilets in all the men's rooms....my bad,
Posted By: chewbacca Re: State 2006 - 03/03/05 10:51 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by VS Vike coach:
Hey, I know I missed the smells of the ag show in Wichita this year....oh wait, that was the backed-up toilets in all the men's rooms....my bad,
or that could be the smell of what's coming out of acbulldog's mouth
Posted By: kck_kat Re: State 2006 - 03/04/05 02:02 AM
I'm with Peterman. Although I hated the way everyone was treated in Wichita, I did like the big show. It was like the wrestlers were being really celebrated. I hope that the tourney will not be held in a high school. Then it will seem no different than any other tourney that the wrestlers participate in all year. Also, coming from the KC area, my school is 4-A, but many of the area schools are 5-A and I have watched and supported many of those wrestlers throughout their wrestling careers. It would be sad to watch them all year and then not be able to watch them at state. The fact of the matter is that Wichita sucked and has for at least the last few years that I have been there. Wherever they take place, we will see great wrestling and there will always be a few surprises! (Just as it should be!)
Posted By: Nigel Isom Re: State 2006 - 03/04/05 09:43 AM
I think everyone has missed the point. 4A schools didn't choose to leave Wichita, at the time when each class was looking to move to a new arena it was becasue the collesium said they were going to do repairs and that it would not be available. Its not like all the 4A schools got together and said we don't like it here anymore. By that time KSHSAA had already made an agreement with the Bi-Center to host 4A. I don't look to see these classes reuniting anytime soon, and from what I can see the only ones whining about it are 5 and 6A, which is odd to me, do they really need 4A to keep themselves entertained?
Posted By: acbulldog Re: State 2006 - 03/04/05 05:18 PM
no 4a is usually very overrated besides a select few individuals. im not saying they suck or anything but they are not all their cracked up to be.
Posted By: RJW Re: State 2006 - 03/04/05 05:52 PM
Lucky for you bull, you won't have to watch our overrated wrestlers at State for the next couple of years. I love how you call us cow folks or hicks, but your posts read like a three-year-old wrote them. Maybe you could come out to the sticks for a little education.
Posted By: Ryan Jilka Re: State 2006 - 03/04/05 06:33 PM
One more thing: I was lucky enough to have the chance to pick up Steve Martin of Old Dominion University and bring him to the Coaches clinic in Salina this year. He, as is true for most coach/clinicians, was not here to teach, but to recruit. Because I have been lucky enough to see 3 classes at state, I told him about every kid I could think of that would be a good college recruit. I doubt he contacted all of them (and he already knew of some), but if I'd never seen Taplin, Grater, Marrs, and many other 4A guys at state I could not have even put in a plug for them.

How many other Kansans would get to wrestle on scholarships if coaches could go to ONE place to preview guys?
Posted By: Nigel Isom Re: State 2006 - 03/04/05 08:28 PM
Overated? Wow Rick, bulldog is proof positive that people down there in Ark City really are stuck on themselves. By the way Ryan, if you really want to see wrestlers from other classes, how about you attend some of their season tournaments, or invite them to your season tournaments. You can;t tell me the only evaluating you do is during the state tournament.
Posted By: Ryan Jilka Re: State 2006 - 03/04/05 10:42 PM
Nigel,
We do go to a few tournaments with other classes. As a matter of fact, we got to see Abilene at Emporia this year, and they are a great team. We used to have Hugoton and Herrington at our tournament. Buhler is still there. We actually see quite a few other classes. However, I think it is best for our team to compete against as many 6A teams as possible to prepare for State. I don't spend time evaluating college prospects unless it's convenient.

My point was that college coaches would have a much easier time if they could go to 1 state tournament. This is not a point to belabor, but it could help our sport a little bit more. Again, I am not one of those people that bashes other classes. I've coached and/or wrestled in each of them. I'm more about what is good for wrestling than my own personal cause.
Posted By: NurseKs Re: State 2006 - 03/05/05 12:32 AM
Doesn't Nationals in Lincoln give coaches a chance to see a huge variety of kids from all over the United States? Or is it not attended by many Kansas kids?
Posted By: mike fairleigh Re: State 2006 - 03/05/05 04:03 AM
three classes on multiple mats was fun at times, but I tried to keep up the winners and losers in my programfor all 3 classes for only a short time and then quickly gave up. I came to see all I could, but my primary interest was in the 4a competion and how it was playing out. I look forward to next season when the entire venue plays to the class that I am there to see primarily, but I will miss being able to see the occasional match in 5 or 6 that is of interest to me, as well. In no way does not getting that chance keep me from attending Salina, nor will it keep the 5a or 6a guys from being wherever they end up. So the action will all be the same, and there will be (my opinion) as many people as before. the drawback for KSHAA is in the fact that they have to support two tournament sites, which may be more expensive. Even though the cost of the Colliseum was getting very high (as I uderstand it) it may not be possible to have two operations for the same money. If they can't look for those ticket prices to go up!
Posted By: Computerized Shoes Re: State 2006 - 03/05/05 04:56 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by acbulldog:
wichita i mean now i sound like the cow folk lol.
acbulldog: You must ride the short bus to school. I am part of the 4A "cow folk" in which you seem to be bashing on. I'll have you know that I maintain a 4.0 gpa while taking AP classes. Does Ark City High offer any challenging courses beside English (seems to be the subject your struggling the most in). I feel for you man/woman, the insanely high level of ignorance presented in nearly everyone of your posts seems only to slap you in the face.

Andrew

p.s. Keep your safety helmet on!
Posted By: D. Fairleigh Re: State 2006 - 03/08/05 03:11 AM
Computerized shoes, your the man!! I am so tired of 5a and 6a people talking about 4a like we are a bunch of hicks. We are for sure just as good of wrestlers as they are.

Going to salina will be fun because it will be compleatly 4a and will probly be ran i little freindlier. And maybe the matts wont feel like concreat or be about 3 feet in diameter small( anybody else notice that? i think it was matt 2)
however i will miss some of the 5a/6a people that i know. And if it would have ben at hays this year i would have had to warm up on my own the second day as i was the only pratt kid alive and was fortanate that hutch was short a guy.
Posted By: RichardDSalyer Re: State 2006 - 03/08/05 10:16 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by D. Fairleigh:
And maybe the matts wont feel like concreat or be about 3 feet in diameter small( anybody else notice that? i think it was matt 2)
All of the wrestling mats were regulation size mats as per the NFHS and KSHSAA regulations.
Posted By: sportsfan02 Re: State 2006 - 03/08/05 10:51 AM
Mat 2 or 3 was a freestyle mat and thus had the broken line inside the circle but was as Mr. Salyer says, regulation.
Posted By: Larry Wagner Re: State 2006 - 03/08/05 12:41 PM
I was told the mats were sitting on top of ice in Wichita. If it is like Kid's State, they got like concrete by the end of the tournament.

Although my sons said the mats they wrestled on were OK and not like Kid's State. My guess is that they were a different type of mat that is less susceptible to cold temperatures.
Posted By: TCarmona Re: State 2006 - 03/08/05 03:05 PM
Wrestled there many times and I never noticed a big problem more concerned with my match.
Posted By: mtisch Re: State 2006 - 03/10/05 08:57 AM
I enjoyed 3,2,1A television broadcast. Why can't 4A and 5,6A do the same? I am really disappointed that all the Kansas High School Wrestlers are not at the same location so people have a chance to see the kids, that they know from kids wrestling perfor, performing at the high school level. If 4,5,6A had not been at the same location this year, I would have missed the most exciting and unique move to win 6A 145 by Romero Cotton. That move should be on a highlight video. It was so fast, if you blinked you would have missed it. I had to see it again, so I went to see his father for a replay. It was still so fast you really need to see it in slow motion to enjoy the real beauty of it. If anyone remembers seeing Cael Sanderson being introduced before the match for his 4th NCAA Championship match, they showed a few highlights from his youth and high school matches. In one of those matches, Cael did a 360 and took his opponent down in a kids match. If you saw that move, and you replayed it at 3X speed, and you could immagine a change of level, that resembled a 360 twist of a corkscrew, from Cotton's shoulder level being at his opponent's shoulder level, to Cotton's shoulder's driving under his opponent's hands and into his opponent's legs at just above knee level, you would have a very accurate idea of Cotton's awesome move that won the high school freshman a 6a State Championship. I think when you have all the high school campionships at the same venue, you have a much better event. When you divide it into 3 locations I think it will produce 3 events that have much less interest, excitement and pleasure than if they were combined.
Posted By: D. Fairleigh Re: State 2006 - 03/13/05 02:51 AM
The mats werent getting hard from the ice, the 4a mats were just alot harder than the 5&6a mats. It was very noticable when running laps. you could tell a big difference. Ask anybody who was there.
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