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As time passes so do philosophies and methods. The old school thinking that wrestlers have to drop weight to be competitive is obselete and can kill our sport. Very, very few kids are mentally strong enough to drop weight and have fun in the sport. So I ask, why would you encourage kids to miss meals and destroy all of the muscle they worked hard to put on? Sure there are exceptions, kids who don't eat right and need to eliminate fat but when you have a shredded athlete and you ask him to drop 10, 15, or 20 pounds all season you are killing your athlete and our sport. You don't have to believe me. There are lots of examples or kids who recently wrestled without dropping weight classes to win. It is purely a mindset that we need to eliminate.

http://www.flowrestling.org/videos/cover...-cutting-weight


Will Cokeley
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I could not agree with your post or the concepts of the video more. I absolutely agree.

However I also firmly believe that for this to actually happen wrestling has to start creating more opportunities for the larger athletes. I am not just talking about the 215 and 285 pound areas. I mean for the high school wrestlers over 160. Right now we only have four classes for those athletes, 171, 189, 215 and 285. It is not enough opportunity for this to really work. I am not advocating here dropping the lowest weight class 103 or even raising it but for adjustments on the weight classes in between. Wrestling would need to raise the differentials between weight classes for these ideas to really work. It will not work with our current five pound differentials in weight classes 120, 125, 130, 135, 140, and 145. The reason it will not work in my opinion is that you would have too many wrestlers in the 160 and over range due to all this increased strength building and lack of weight cutting. There would not be enough weight classes to accomodate them.


Vince Nowak
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Vince,

I applaud your effort to create more weight classes but instead of hijacking the weight cutting post, go find some data on male student athlete's weight distribution. 98, 105, 112, 119, 126, 132, 138, 145, 155, 167, 185, HWT were the weights in 1981. That is four above 145. Today, 103, 112, 119, 125, 130, 135, 140, 145, 152, 160, 171, 189, 215, 285 which is six above or a fifty percent increase. I don't think a stance against weight cutting really helps your plight. It is a stretch unless you can show us the distribution of weight in the population along with the pct of body fat. If there are a bunch of really lean guys above 171 then you might use this stance to support your agenda.


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I think it's a pretty good video for some of us Dad's too! Thanks for the post!


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Originally Posted By: Cokeley
Vince,

I applaud your effort to create more weight classes but instead of hijacking the weight cutting post, go find some data on male student athlete's weight distribution. 98, 105, 112, 119, 126, 132, 138, 145, 155, 167, 185, HWT were the weights in 1981. That is four above 145. Today, 103, 112, 119, 125, 130, 135, 140, 145, 152, 160, 171, 189, 215, 285 which is six above or a fifty percent increase. I don't think a stance against weight cutting really helps your plight. It is a stretch unless you can show us the distribution of weight in the population along with the pct of body fat. If there are a bunch of really lean guys above 171 then you might use this stance to support your agenda.


Will, did you mean to say I took a stance for weight cutting with my post?

I am definitely against excessive weight cutting. Isn't that what the trainer in the video is saying also to be against excessive weight cutting?

My whole point of my first post is that I would like to see more wrestlers do what this trainer in the video suggested in wrestling big and strong. I agree with that. The problem is that unfortunately when they get bigger they find fewer weight classes available for them.

For example in his video he talks about a kid who was ripped at 153 at the start of wrestling season but he decides to cut into his muscle that he had built up in the off season and wrestle 135. Okay let's assume he was a junior and that also in his class there were three other juniors who came into the season also ripped at similar weights around 150 to 160 and they decided to also cut weight like the first guy and the others wrestled that year at 145, 152 and 160. Now they are going into their senior year and all four guys workout hard again that summer and come in ripped around 165 to 170. Okay now we have four varsity guys from the previous year all ripped at around 165 to 170, the message is that they should all wrestle strong and not cut weight. The problem is there is only one weight class 171. I will give you two and throw in 160. Still that would be only two weight classes for those four guys. The only point I am making here is that the fewer weight classes for wrestlers over 160 is part of the reason that wrestlers will do an excessive amount of weight cutting.

I think what I said is very related to the topic. I will drop it on this topic though because I absolutely agree with him that wrestlers should not do excessive weight cutting and I am a strong advocate of wrestlers wrestling big and strong.

Oh by the way there are plenty of lean and ripped high school athletes around 170 pounds or over.


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Cadets at Fargo -- Weight and the number of participants

154 participants competing at 84-105 pounds or 21 pound range and remember 103 is the lightest weight in high school

94 participants in 189 - 285 or 96 pound range

Largest numbers by weight are 119, 112, & 125

The middle of all these wrestlers is in the 130 pound group half above and half below

The lower half (483.5 wrestlers) are grouped in 8 weights and the upper half (483.5 wrestlers) are grouped in 10 weights --- 130lbs is counted twice since the middle of the participation is somewhere in that group.

Fargo Cadet participation by weight 2010
967 participants

My opinion of raising the 103 lb class up - they should not do it.

Adding more upper weights - I do not think it is warrented on the current participation numbers.

The goal to increase the number of wrestlers 189 and over will always have the dual sport problem. I have seen some very talented wrestler/football players chose one sport. Some of the problem is with the HS coaching pressure to chose one or the other. From what I have seen most of the pressure comes from the football side of coaching. Dual sport athletes are diminishing.




1. 84 84.00 17 No No No Mat 2 Pool Straight Bracket Place 8
2. 91 91.00 37 No No No Mat 2 Pool Straight Bracket Place 8
3. 98 98.00 53 No No No Mat 2 Pool Straight Bracket Place 8
4. 105 105.00 67 No No No Mat 2 Pool Straight Bracket Place 8
5. 112 112.00 85 No No No Mat 2 Pool Straight Bracket Place 8
6. 119 119.00 95 No No No Mat 2 Pool Straight Bracket Place 8
7. 125 125.00 83 No No No Mat 2 Pool Straight Bracket Place 8
8. 130 130.00 67 No No No Mat 2 Pool Straight Bracket Place 8
9. 135 135.00 63 No No No Mat 2 Pool Straight Bracket Place 8
10. 140 140.00 66 No No No Mat 2 Pool Straight Bracket Place 8
11. 145 145.00 56 No No No Mat 2 Pool Straight Bracket Place 8
12. 152 152.00 67 No No No Mat 2 Pool Straight Bracket Place 8
13. 160 160.00 67 No No No Mat 2 Pool Straight Bracket Place 8
14. 171 171.00 50 No No No Mat 2 Pool Straight Bracket Place 8
15. 189 189.00 33 No No No Mat 2 Pool Straight Bracket Place 8
16. 215 215.00 36 No No No Mat 2 Pool Straight Bracket Place 8
17. 285 285.00 25 No No No Mat 2 Pool Straight Bracket Place 8




Last edited by smokeycabin; 07/21/10 10:57 AM.
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The junior count in greco - 859 particiapnts.

Half of the participants are below 140.
The highest count was at 145.

Good numbers in the upper weights here and using these weights looks like a pretty balanced distribution.

Overall the middle of the weight from 98 to 285 would be 181 pounds

210 (25%) wrestlers are 171 pounds and above or are in 4 (26%)of the weight classes available.




1 98 98 18
2 105 105 25
3 112 112 40
4 119 119 63
5 125 125 74
6 130 130 64
7 135 135 70
8 140 140 75
429
9 145 145 77
10 152 152 69
11 160 160 64
12 171 171 57
13 189 189 62
14 215 215 53
15 285 285 48

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There was an interesting article today in the Kansas City Star about total body workouts devised by a former wrestler and wrestling coach that I think is similar to the workout philosophy of the original post that Will made. It seems to me that this type of workouts and strength training would be excellent for wrestlers.

http://www.kansascity.com/2010/07/30/2118807/fitness-routine-relies-on-old.html#Comments_Container

Also here are about 13 photos of the type of total body exercises that this group is doing:

http://www.kansascity.com/2010/07/30/2118340/fyi-good-and-tired-fitness-routine.html

Last edited by Husker Fan; 08/01/10 02:58 AM. Reason: to add link to photos of exercises

Vince Nowak
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